12 replies to this topic

[Xi-3]

These are members of the Avengers who should be on Avengers teams, but are not. While I was doing research for this set, I found information that showed how Ben Grimm had gotten stronger. I have added the Level-8 card to the New Avengers Set. As I have said before, the intent for all the Avengers Sets was to split the cards by team so they would be less overwhelming to see. This does not place any restriction on using cards from different sets. I encourage doing so, in order to pull together a deck that reflects your own style.

One of the others brought it to my attention that while I appreciate feedback and specific advice on how to get closer to OCG, there are some things that I am less willing to change. This is because I use a form of shorthand that is clearly not OCG, to compress text and make things fit on less space. My goal is to fit as much of an effect as I can onto the Description field without shrinking the text so much it cannot be read, but at the same time to come as close to the OCG as I can. This means I come up with a number of terms that are not as intuitive as I thought they would be. They include:

- Special Summon Lv#. Refers to that Level of the hero indicated on the card. More limiting than 'hero of Level-# or lower.'
- hero: Used as more appropriate than 'monster.' I use 'unit' the same way in my Gundam 00 and Star Wars sets.
- control/influence/poison effects: Exist as damaging effects in the game (ie: Crush Card Virus). I refer to them by category to save space. Some of the cards in my other sets have such effects as well.
- WATER/ice, LIGHT/warm, DARK/cold: I use this to indicate a point on the power spectrum. The last two are more for Ala Alba, but I like to cover my bases anyway. Since Ice does not exist as a type, I added it to WATER. I applied the same method to the other two attributes.
- negate # effect: Denotes monster effects, Spells, and Traps, but must be a limited number only to avoid full immunity issues. By this virtue, it implicitly includes a cool-down period before the effect can be used again. Contrast to 'immune to monster effects.'
- a group/team name in the Circulation Field: indicates what team or team the card is a part of, to determine whether s/he is affected by an effect.
- tribute [name] with # Counters: I'm told the OCG is to say 'remove # Counters.' I could use this because 'remove from play' got changed to 'banish,' however it still takes up more space. The tribute is part of the tribute summon system, which makes sense to me -- but that's just me. I am willing to change this if I can find a way to say it in less words.

Anyway, here are the last cards for my current Avengers Sets. Once I'm done I'm going to go back to my original Avengers set and remove the cards I revised, so I can avoid being redundant. At the same time, I'll leave the cards for heroes I have not revised, so if people are curious they can see who else was among the Avengers. Mind you, that's still not all 87 Avengers. Neither are these. Enjoy them anyway, and as always please do comment and feel free to give me any specific suggestions for improvement you may have. Everything helps, I assure you, especially if you can help me with the OCG while keeping the words tight.

Tier-1 Avengers

Tier-3 Avengers

Spells

Traps

Fusions

Out-of-the-Fire Fusions

Turns out Johnny doesn't stay dead very well, even accounting for the 'nobody stays dead except Uncle Ben' rule. I've got to say it, I'm sorry: "Heeeeeeeeeere's Johnny!" Also, this makes the Secret Avengers set the only one without its own version of the Unipower card. Fun, right?

[Mistery Hunter]

Pretty good cards, i got one personal problem with them... their effects are long. But hey that's because I'm dyslectic and suck at reading, good cards, good pictures, and good balanced cards. OCG... i don't care about that.
keep up the good work

[Xi-3]

I do try, even though I know someone's going to come around and call something 'unbalanced.' I still want to learn how to make a better card. The fact that I think Konami's OCG is often unwieldy is irrelevant, but I don't think I want people going around talking about 'XCG' too. Even that may not be a bad thing: innovation and invention happen because someone dares to challenge what's official. I'm happy as long as the point of the cards come across. If, on the other hand, people come and say 'what does this do' or 'this doesn't make any sense!' -- that's when I have a problem.

In related news, I have gathered together a deck made from cards using each Avenger set, plus a couple goodies from the Cuteness Counterattack Set. They've practically become staples for my decks ever since I made them. But it's a real challenge getting down to 60 to make a deck. Plus, you can only have 15 cards in the Extra Deck. I had not known that originally.

[Alpha9630]

Your cards have very nice artwork, and some interesting effects, but you really should consider changing some things.

I don't think you should have the human name on each of your monster cards, it just looks cluttered/bad. And instead of having "Avenger" be the type card hybrid with warrior, you could just have it the name of the card instead.

I'd recommend changes like name your first card here to: "Avenger Mr.Fantastic LV4", instead of "Reed Richards / Mister Fantastic LV4". If you go with my idea, and think "Hulk" is too short for a name, you could say "The Incredible Hulk" instead. This way you can have spell and trap cards that say "Search your deck for an "Avenger" card, and add it to your deck" Without having Avenger be a whole new type.

Also there are some problems with your spell cards like "Girl Power" and many other ones. It states it only works on "Female Avengers", but there is no way to properly identify that with your setup. It could say instead: "This card effect applies to She-Hulk, Invisible Woman, etc." Or perhaps on the title of the cards, you could make it say "Female Avenger Susan Storm" instead. Right now it doesn't work well, because it would be ambiguous (Uncertain) which cards are female avengers, and which ones aren't.

I know Black Panther is a male avenger, but people who are unfamiliar with him might think he is a girl. That's why you need a better way of organizing your cards here.

[Xi-3]

Thank you for your advice, Alpha. I shall consider what you have said. For the moment, here are my feelings:

Adding 'Avenger' to the name of each card would, I feel, make them just as clumsy. Can you imagine saying "I summon 'Avenger Mr. Fantastic Lv4?'" It's a mouthful, and quite honestly a bit embarrassing to even think about saying it. Having 'Avenger' as a sub-type works, in my opinion, because doing so ensures it is functionally out of the way, while also allowing other cards to affect them. I do not know why having 'Avenger' as a subtype would be an issue, however I am open to being illuminated on the matter.

I also include the heroes' civilian names because it can be crucial to distinguish between the heroes. There were, from one time to another, 2 'Iron Man' (not including Iron Man 2.0), no less than four 'Captain America,' 2 'Ms. Marvel' (including Moonstone with the Dark Avengers), and 'Spider-Woman' has been passed around since Julia Carpenter first had the name (she is now Madame Web). If anything, I would drop the hero name. I will also tell you honestly that when I use the cards I am more likely to refer to the characters by their civilian names. It will be clear enough what the player is doing anyway. 'Hulk,' by the way, is not 'too short.' It's fine, however there are multiple Hulks as well. Players need to distinguish between them, at least on the cards.

Even without the pictures of well-endowed women in skin-tight and/or revealing outfits it should be fairly easy to discover if a card is female. Often they have 'Girl' or 'Woman' in the name. When they do not, they appear to use terms typically used to refer to females, such as 'Valkyrie.' Often the civilian name, like Daisy and Maria, can serve as an indication. There might be an issue with Storm's card, until you look at the picture. The next one that might be an issue is 'Mockingbird,' which is not definitively male or female -- but 'Barbara' is. 'She-Hulk' especially is a non-issue on this matter, because her name has 'she' in it. Come to think of it, because determining the hero's gender is necessary for some cards keeping both the civilian name and the callsign might also be necessary -- but speaking of defining genders, I often refer to 'he' or 'she 'or 'him' or 'her' in the Description field. It seems there are many ways to tell gender. That makes listing all the female heroes on a card unnecessary. This is good, because that would take quite a bit of space.

Not to mention 'Girl Power' is not significant enough for me to have included in my 'Ultimate Avengers Deck.'

I understand what you are saying with Black Panther's example, particularly since T'Challa handed his original totem's power over to his sister (I think that's her on the left side on the Fusion version of Sue's card). T'Challa got another panther totem, though, so he is also a Black Panther again. No worries about distinguishing between the two: T'Challa's sister is distinctly feminine in form.

Given all this, I do not believe I need to change anything yet. If anyone brings further specific suggestions or requests I could happily see to them, provided they work. I really do appreciate all feedback, even if I do not end up using many of them. At the very least, they get me thinking.

[Alpha9630]

I hate to say it, but I think I would be more embarassed saying "I summon Reed Richards, Mister Fantastic Level Four" than I would if I said "I summon Avenger Mr.Fantastic Level Four", but that is just me.

Perhaps if you said "New Avenger" instead it would flow better. "I summon New Avenger Mr. Fantastic Level Four" sounds not too shabby.

I'm just concerned about the identifications of the cards, but I see this is moving somewhat away from how Yugioh would potentially do an avengers set, and I understand where you are coming from.

For the problem you encountered with the Multiple Ironman's Captain America's, etc. You could give certain unique attributes to their names. Like for Ironman, I know he has things like the "Mark 1, and 2 armor", the "Hulk Buster", "War Machine", and other armor types. You could do things like for example how the different "Stardust Dragons" were named, applying something like "Tactical mode Ironman", or "Cival War Captain America", "Patriotic Captain America", "New Age Captain America" wouldn't be such a bad idea.

Also you are welcome with the critiques I have given, and I definitely understand your point about liking criticism, but not often following it.The important thing is you don't take offense to any recommendation I make, as my intent is to help you make your product better.

[Xi-3]

Hah-hah! That's funny.
I actually would say "I summon Reed Richards," or "I summon Mister Fantastic." It almost sounds normal, you know?

'New Avenger' does not work because of the New Avengers team. Just as it would be confusing with the main Avengers and Secret Avengers teams, it would be confusing to call someone a New Avenger when they're not part of the team. If you look at my other sets I actually put the name of the team in the Circulation Field. I have also denoted it with the ID numbers: A is for Avengers (main), NA is for New Avengers, RA is for Reserve Avengers (although these guys aren't actually part of an Avengers team, so I couldn't rightly put the name under Circulation), and SA is for Secret Avengers. Even when you pull the cards together from different sets to make a deck it still works that way. I mean, I didn't end up making it so all the team leaders boosted the heroes on their teams. There wasn't really enough room to do that for Cage or Barton, and anyway they don't have the same inspiring effect that Cap does.

Solving the identity issues with different versions would work if I was looking at a full-history version of the characters, as I tried to do with my original Avenger set. It became overwhelmingly large, which is one reason I decided to use the teams to define the different sets: it all came out much more neatly, I think. I went with the same idea as the one I used with my revised Ala Alba Set, namely focusing on a snapshot of how the characters are now. More or less, anyway: there are many heroes who gained power through experience and by exercising. The Fantastic Four/Future Foundation members are clearly not snap-shot, yet I managed to do it with Tony Stark (who, in the process of rebooting his brain and creating the Bleeding Edge armour melted down all his other armours - originally this translated to banishing the earlier armours). The snapshot is a perfect strategy for minimizing the number of cards required, though, especially since I have a penchant for leveling monsters. I made it work as best I could.

There are different Stardust Dragons? Maybe I should go back to reading 5D's. It could be interesting.

As I said originally I had cards for the different armours. It came out to 5, plus a Fusion just for Tony. Now I have two, because I have one with his armour standing by, and the other with it deployed. Other than a Mk- designation, I identified one as the Extremis armour, and the last as Bleeding Edge, his current suit. While I had some issues, like with the Invisible Woman, with heroes who don't change their names very much. For those I just used a Lv designation -- but my favourite is She-Hulk's, because she has different law degrees. It made me think "oh, I can use those. Even people who don't know what they mean can at least count stars, but it's very cool to acknowledge that she's really a brilliant person, as well as having supermodel looks." The other was adding 'Avenging' to a name for some of the Level-8's, after I first did it for Spider-Man. I thought it was appropriate, since many joined Avengers late in their careers.

I enjoy reading feedback because I believe everything has the possibility of helping me learn. The only ones I do not enjoy are the disrespectful, entirely negative ones, and I doubt I'll see any of that here -- least of all from you because you've been entirely understanding of my views. People are welcome to disagree with what I've done too, after all doing so inspired me to create two Star Wars sets. I do not see anything wrong with others being similarly inspired by my efforts. The end product of all my decks will be dueling purely for fun with family and friends. I print these in black and white on paper anyway, so who's going to take it seriously?

Most importantly, I have been having a lot of fun making these. Now I'm wondering what to do next. I mean, I had an idea for a set based on the Periodic Table of Elements, so I would need to find enough pictures first. Other than that, for now I'm out of ideas for sets. I want to see if I can improve what I have, in the meantime.

[Alpha9630]

If you want to try making a new set of cards, maybe try going with a popular video game franchise you are familiar with.

I'm sure you are familiar with "Ultimate Marvel versus Capcom 3", why not try making a set based on that? Sure there really isn't any fusions/synchro's you can make, but look at the Worm arch type, they had 25 effect monsters, and 1 fusion, and they turned out just fine.

[Xi-3]

Surprise! I've never played it. I'm actually not much of a gamer, being more familiar with older ones. It's mostly because I'm too cheap to buy new games for my computer. I'm sure I'll get inspired for another set eventually.

Worm archetype? Have you ever played Worms? Or even the original version, Gorillas, on Visual Basic. They're the original Angry Birds. Meh. I'll think of something good later.

[lionman]

were are the cards noob

[Xi-3]

They're under the Spoilers, 'noob.' And I believe you necro-posted. Goodbye.

EDIT: Nobody else respond to the troll, please: it is against the rules to post in a thread that has been necro-bumped, and no one else needs to get warning points for this.

[lionman]

make a good hulk this time

[Xi-3]

Can you please be more specific as to what constitutes a 'good hulk' to you? I mean, if I am to take your comment seriously, and not as a spam attempt?

To reiterate, I value all feedback that may lead to improvements with the cards.