Custom TCG: Kaosugēto

[Loyalist]

[spoiler='Note to Mods']If this is the wrong section to post this then please move it for me rather than locking it, thanks.[/spoiler]

 

カオスゲート

 

[spoiler='Legal Disclaimer']This is my first time I have put serious dedication into a new card game and although I have taken ideas from other card games and the artwork is mostly from deviant art this is completely for the enjoyment of me any the internet and makes no money in the process.[/spoiler]

 

[spoiler='Introduction']The game is called "Kaosugēto" or "Chaos Gate". In the game both players represent Summoners who can call forth beings and creatures from the magical realm by opening a gateway, known by in this game as the Chaos Gate, hence the name. What makes this different from other card games? Well first thing is there is no main deck and there is no graveyard/discard pile. Any creatures that are defeated or and spells that are cast as merely returned to the Chaos Gate, in this case your chaos gate is represented by 3 different sub-decks/mini-decks (will explain more later).[/spoiler]

 

[spoiler='Basics']First thing is first, both players have 30 life points at the start of the game and 4 piles of cards. The first one is called the "Sigil Deck" which is related to this games mana system and is placed on the far left corner. The others are sorted as follows: Level 1 cards at the bottom right, level 2 cards above and level 3 cards in the top right. What do these levels mean? Well all cards have levels and higher levels often cost more but are stronger (makes sense) but are placed in different piles/decks. This is because as a Summoner you choose what you think is necessary to win, you choose the cards and so have to judge when you think it is worth getting higher level cards based on your "Sigils" which I will explain later.[/spoiler]

 

[spoiler='Turn structure']So now that I have explained the decks I should explain the turn structure.
Here are the phases:
Draw Phase
Sigil Phase
Summon Phase
Combat Phase
End Phase

If this is the first turn of the duel both players will draw 5 cards from the "Level 1" deck before beginning.

During the Draw Phase the player can choose which deck to draw from: level 1,2 or 3. At the start it is often best to draw from level 1 but not much else happens here.

During the Sigil Phase the player will then place the top card of their Sigil Deck in what is called the "Alter". Like in Kaijudo this is your mana but is not tapped or removed since you can only Summon 1 Creature a turn and cast 1 Spell a turn so long as you have the correct "Sigils cards" in the Alter.

During the Summon Phase, as explained above you can Summon 1 Creature AND cast 1 Spell, so long as you have what is required.

The Combat Phase is simply where Creatures attack, I will go on about how a battle is resolved later on.

Not much happens in the End Phase, It is just where '1 turn' abilities/effects end. There is no Hand limit so no need to worry about that.[/spoiler]

 

So i've explained the basics of the game but you have yet to see any cards so here is the FIRST ROUGH CARD:

 

[spoiler='First Card'][/spoiler]

 

[spoiler='Details of the card']

There are many features on this card so I will go over them 1 by 1.

 

First you can see the name at the top. There is a number next to the name which shows the card's "Level".

This card is level 1 so it would go in its respective pile/deck.

Next to the name and level you can also see 2 'sun' symbols. These represent the card's "Purity" which essentially means you must have two "Order" Sigils (The sun representing Order) in your alter to play it.

 

There are also 3 other numbers. From left to right, or in this card Green to red these are: Health, Chaos Power and Strike Power. Chaos Power and strike power are pretty much the same thing. When you attack a Creature your opponent takes damage equal to one of those values (you choose which value to use when the creature is summoned and cannot change your choice afterwards). But what is the difference? Why not just choose the highest value? Well Chaos Power is almost always higher than strike power but it comes at a cost. If you choose Chaos Power your creature gets Summoning sickness but if you choose strike power you can attack instantly.

 

Everything else is straight forward. You have details on the creature like its abilities and you have flavour text. The edition, the set it is in, the circulation and finally it's serial number.

(The star at the bottom signifies it's rarity: Dot/Circle = Common, Star = Uncommon and Shiny Gold star = Rare or better).

 

[/spoiler]

That is it for now since I haven't made any sigil cards or spell cards yet.

 

My hands hurt from typing so any questions you have feel free to leave on this thread for me to answer when my fingers stop aching. I already typed this on another forum and just copied it but trust me when I say my fingers DID hurt.

 

Merry Christmas, Loyalist :)

[D.A._Sakuyamon]

How is mana gained? And at what frequency is it gained?

[Loyalist]

I thought I explained that in the block of text but in short:

 

You have a separate deck of 15 "Sigil" cards (basicly represent mana) at after you draw during your Sigil Phase you place the top card of your Sigil Pile/deck into what is called the Alter (your mana zone). These cards represent your mana.

[D.A._Sakuyamon]

I thought I explained that in the block of text but in short:

 

You have a separate deck of 15 "Sigil" cards (basicly represent mana) at after you draw during your Sigil Phase you place the top card of your Sigil Pile/deck into what is called the Alter (your mana zone). These cards represent your mana.

Like other card games does the mana stay/

[Loyalist]

Like other card games does the mana stay/

The mana builds up every turn and is never removed unless stated by a card otherwise.

 

It isn't tapped but to stop people from playing as many cards as possible they are limited to 1 creature and 1 spell per turn.

 

It is explained in the OP :I

[Loyalist]

UPDATE: I understand it is a lot to read but I put a lot of effort into this (took 3 hours just to make the template for the cards).

So I put it all in spoilers and made it easier to take in.

[DeathSDelano]

Its interesting, the mana system could work, and can make the games slower due to limitations, another method of mana[don't have to use it, just suggesting though your probably already thought about it], is when you use mana, you could place it into a separate zone[similar to battle spirits where core used for cost go to trash, but return at start of next turn], for the turn after use, to allow use of more cards as the games progress. Again this is just a suggestion that does not need to be taken, if you want it as is, then fine. 

 

Also is there a point to the number on the bottom left? Or just following Yugioh format? Honestly, hard to say how it would be, by what your are saying without seeing a few more card samples.

[Loyalist]

Its interesting, the mana system could work, and can make the games slower due to limitations, another method of mana[don't have to use it, just suggesting though your probably already thought about it], is when you use mana, you could place it into a separate zone[similar to battle spirits where core used for cost go to trash, but return at start of next turn], for the turn after use, to allow use of more cards as the games progress. Again this is just a suggestion that does not need to be taken, if you want it as is, then fine. 

 

Also is there a point to the number on the bottom left? Or just following Yugioh format? Honestly, hard to say how it would be, by what your are saying without seeing a few more card samples.

I'm interested in your suggestion on the mana system, I've never played Battle Spirits but I'd like to know more about it before making a final judgement.

 

As for the number it is just a random serial number (Yes I got it from the yugioh format) wasn't sure it I needed it or not so just put it in anyway.

 

Thanks for the feedback!

[DeathSDelano]

serial number is not really needed. Most card games don't have it.

 

As for battle spirits let me get a link: http://battle-spirits.wikia.com/wiki/How_to_Play

is came here in 2009, but flopped because of Yugioh and magic being dominate[and lack of advertising], but is still going strong in japan[like most card games]. It also had some complexity to it, but not really that hard to understand once you played a few games.

[Loyalist]

serial number is not really needed. Most card games don't have it.

 

As for battle spirits let me get a link: http://battle-spirits.wikia.com/wiki/How_to_Play

is came here in 2009, but flopped because of Yugioh and magic being dominate[and lack of advertising], but is still going strong in japan[like most card games]. It also had some complexity to it, but not really that hard to understand once you played a few games.

Thanks that helps.

 

I think I will probably end up keeping my current mana system unless the majority dislike it in favour of a mana system more similar to this.

[Loyalist]

I have made the first "Spell" card. Pretty similar layout to the Creatures but with obvious differences. Take a look and see what you think!

[spoiler='First Spell'][/spoiler]

Eager to hear your opinions.

[Loyalist]

BUMP.

 

I don't often put a lot of work into things, hope I get more people looking at this. I may even create decks so that people can play test it (need to find some sort of program for that), that way I can receive better feedback.

[werewolfjedi]

I think that the game is unbalanced in concept from the fact that I will assume that you construct these decks yourself.

this would mean that you know how many turns you would have to wait before level 3 deck is all you need to play from.

once you know that number, you plan on it, and that will make a very limited end game, regardless of lower level answers.

I would suggest that sigils are exhausted a turn they are used for a summon or spell, and you have to wait till your next turn to use them again. and then make spells be unlimited per turn, but needing the sigils. this kinda puts it in line with yugioh. and just make it VERY hard for spells to summon monsters. like, a level 3 spell would cycle the level 1 deck till you got a guy, 'for free'

I think it would be prudent to work on the battle phase and flesh it out. will it be like magic, or like yugioh, where in you attack the monsters, or the opponent, and they choose to block or not.

in addition. counter play is a heavy element in all these games. your game does not have it, and the balancing of vanguard is in triggered abilities, that do things on your opponent's turn.

[Loyalist]

I think that the game is unbalanced in concept from the fact that I will assume that you construct these decks yourself.

this would mean that you know how many turns you would have to wait before level 3 deck is all you need to play from.

once you know that number, you plan on it, and that will make a very limited end game, regardless of lower level answers.

I would suggest that sigils are exhausted a turn they are used for a summon or spell, and you have to wait till your next turn to use them again. and then make spells be unlimited per turn, but needing the sigils. this kinda puts it in line with yugioh. and just make it VERY hard for spells to summon monsters. like, a level 3 spell would cycle the level 1 deck till you got a guy, 'for free'

I think it would be prudent to work on the battle phase and flesh it out. will it be like magic, or like yugioh, where in you attack the monsters, or the opponent, and they choose to block or not.

in addition. counter play is a heavy element in all these games. your game does not have it, and the balancing of vanguard is in triggered abilities, that do things on your opponent's turn.

There are a lot of issues with the game that you have noted:

I said earlier that if people disliked the sigil system I would change it and that appears to be the case so I will work on that as soon as possible.

 

As for the levels I wish for there to be "variety" in the costs, a lot of cards will require different types of sigils (say for instance you have a Chaos/Order deck and you have 3 order and 1 chaos, would you risk getting a chaos creature that you would wait to summon or would you be cautious?), now as you said people would supposedly be smart about this and construct their deck in a way that they could remember the numbers and get the correct cards, which is why deck construction is a VERY important part of this game.Not entirely sure how I could adjust this since this is the most unique part of the game.

 

I understand the lack of detail on the Combat Phase, I will redo that part to explain it further.

 

I was considering adding in what I would call "Reaction effects" which can either be in the form of a Creature (like a hand trap in yugioh) or a spell that you can cast on your opponents turn if conditions are met - Using the suggested sigil system you would have to save sigils to cast these. I think that would make this more strategic since you would have to judge whether or not it is worth using spells on your turn or saving sigils to hopefullycounter your opponent.

 

I thank you greatly for taking the time to give such constructive feedback.

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

Seems like a unique idea here. Unless it's going to be a Japanese TCG though, I think you just just outright call it Chaos Gate, seeing as the name otherwise is literally just saying it with an accent. Also, I believe you mean to say "Altar" instead of "Alter"? If it's something you will be taking serious, it's important to have the right spelling for these things.

 

On the mechanics themselves, I'm assuming you get to see your hand before you draw from a deck at the start of the game? Because if you do get to see it, it's highly likely you actually won't want to draw from a level 1 deck since you will want to be digging for good higher level summons early on, and you already have some level 1's you can play in-hand. Unless you drew really bad. Though this does depend on how quickly it will typically take to play Level 2's.

 

This also brings up the question of how many of each card you're allowed, and does every deck have 15 cards, or is it just the 1?

[Loyalist]

Seems like a unique idea here. Unless it's going to be a Japanese TCG though, I think you just just outright call it Chaos Gate, seeing as the name otherwise is literally just saying it with an accent. Also, I believe you mean to say "Altar" instead of "Alter"? If it's something you will be taking serious, it's important to have the right spelling for these things.

 

On the mechanics themselves, I'm assuming you get to see your hand before you draw from a deck at the start of the game? Because if you do get to see it, it's highly likely you actually won't want to draw from a level 1 deck since you will want to be digging for good higher level summons early on, and you already have some level 1's you can play in-hand. Unless you drew really bad. Though this does depend on how quickly it will typically take to play Level 2's.

 

This also brings up the question of how many of each card you're allowed, and does every deck have 15 cards, or is it just the 1?

I can see there are a lot of things I forgot to cover:

The name is ok as Chaos Gate I suppose, I just like the japanese symbols because it reminds me of Yugioh. (Also the game WAS going to be based off japanese folklore but I ditched that idea because it limited my options for creatures etc.)

 

Thanks for letting me know about the spelling error, yes I did mean Altar. If you mean by "serious" putting a lot of decication and making it a good game then yes, however I don't plan for this to ever be profitable, just for fun.

 

I was thinking about a guideline for the levels to cost similar to this: Level 1 costs 0 to 3 sigils, level 2 costs 3 to 5 sigils and level 3 costs anything in excess of 5 sigils.

 

About the deck sizes this hasn't been fully decided but I was considering having it with 15 cards for level 1 (since this is where you draw the first 5 cards) and all other decks must contain at least 10 cards. Sigils I was thinking about having 10 to 15.

 

Thanks for your feedback, well appreciated!

[Loyalist]

UPDATE: It is nothing fancy but I have an image showing the layout of the game for those who are confused:

 

[spoiler='Layout'][/spoiler]

[Loyalist]

Still in the middle of making the first set, I want your opinions on whether having the sigils overlap looks ok because to me I feel there must be a better method (e.g. using numbers similar to magic the gathering).

 

[spoiler='First level 3?'][/spoiler]

 

This is also the first Rare.

 

I will also be removing the serial numbers from the cards since I have no use for them.

[death00]

why do you question whether it is level three or not, it obviously is level 3, there are three suns. 

[Loyalist]

why do you question whether it is level three or not, it obviously is level 3, there are three suns. 

The suns don't represent the level of a card, the number does. And I wasn't questioning the level I just put a "?" because I didn't know if it would be the "first" level 3 card.

[werewolfjedi]

I know the game is adult and you may have a bit of a weird time looking it at, but consider furotitcon's AP/haven system for the resource base.

if you want 0 sigil cards, they need some other type of cost to be fair. you could even have an entire set based around these type of monsters. a 0 sigil deck set entirely, the level 3s just needing massive numbers of this secondary and easily produced resource.

as an example, each of the symbols in that game from the havens, is generally played for 5 AP. the game gives 10 at the start of every one of their turns. so it takes half of their starting resources to gain a new one of the other type, and it's immediately available I believe.

while an AP producer is 6, in order to stop snowballing playing of them, as in this game you also use 5 ap to draw a card, as that game has no natural draw step.

[Loyalist]

I know the game is adult and you may have a bit of a weird time looking it at, but consider furotitcon's AP/haven system for the resource base.

if you want 0 sigil cards, they need some other type of cost to be fair. you could even have an entire set based around these type of monsters. a 0 sigil deck set entirely, the level 3s just needing massive numbers of this secondary and easily produced resource.

as an example, each of the symbols in that game from the havens, is generally played for 5 AP. the game gives 10 at the start of every one of their turns. so it takes half of their starting resources to gain a new one of the other type, and it's immediately available I believe.

while an AP producer is 6, in order to stop snowballing playing of them, as in this game you also use 5 ap to draw a card, as that game has no natural draw step.

Looked up "furotitcon" and all I got was humanoid animal porn. Eh I guess you did warn me.

 

Still taking a serious perspective on this an AP (I assume action points) system does seem interesting however I feel I MAY be overcomplicating the game a bit. Look at something like Hearthstone. A very simple game but vastly entertaining. I aim to create a game that is easy to learn but hard to master, that way beginners still stand a chance whilst intelligent players will be rewarded because of their creative and strategic plays.

 

I am going to change the Sigils System because many have asked to do so, just trying to find a "simple" system that works better.

As others have suggested "Tapping" or "Exhausting" Sigils would be one way of going about this.

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

A few things I realized could be a problem are

1. How are you going to ensure that players are specifically putting cards of the right level in each deck? It might not entirely be beneficial, but for instance you could be drawing level 2's in your first hand, which could give you an edge. Putting the level on the back of the card is possible, or having them colored differently so people could tell the difference.

2. Smaller decks for the different levels is actually a bad thing in a way, because it means they're more likely to draw the exact one they want. You won't be drawing from them at the start of the game, so being somewhat smaller makes sense, but it could be problematic in this sense, unless you want them to be able to do this.

 

I forgot the third one while I was typing out the others, but I'll let you know if I can think of it.

[Loyalist]

A few things I realized could be a problem are

1. How are you going to ensure that players are specifically putting cards of the right level in each deck? It might not entirely be beneficial, but for instance you could be drawing level 2's in your first hand, which could give you an edge. Putting the level on the back of the card is possible, or having them colored differently so people could tell the difference.

Putting them in the wrong deck is as simple as cheating. It is no different than if you use 2 copies of dark hole in yugioh, you just can't. But the idea of making it so that they are different in appearance is a good idea since it makes said cheating harder to do.

2. Smaller decks for the different levels is actually a bad thing in a way, because it means they're more likely to draw the exact one they want. You won't be drawing from them at the start of the game, so being somewhat smaller makes sense, but it could be problematic in this sense, unless you want them to be able to do this.

If they were in the same deck then they would merely be higher cost cards. I was considering that Spells and Creatures could be separate instead of the 3 levels or I could add another dimension to the system to make it harder to abuse.

[Zeppeli Gyro Supreme]

You say "you just can't", but nobody is going to call you out on it unless they can see the cards you're drawing, which doesn't even happen that often at a tournament level. You can't put invisible into your game, because people can and will cheat. Rules like the number of a card you can have can be checked at the start and end of a tournament, and players usually will be able to find out if they abuse this, while it's a lot harder to keep track of something like how many level 2's they have draw vs how many have been played or are in-hand.