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Noober's Second Rant Sure to get him in BIG trouble


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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/DoubleStandard

https://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20060812143058AAVsnk6

http://www.unwomen.org/en/news/stories/2014/9/emma-watson-gender-equality-is-your-issue-too

 

Discuss. But this time about Sexism against MEN by WOMEN. No corrections. I know there is a ton of crap towards women recently but it seems that most people ignore sexism against men. It does seem that women are morally superior to men and that they are allowed to make any insulting remarks against them without a punishment. But if it is the other way round, oh ho, well ZERO TOLERATION is clearly the answer. If you have nothing relevant to say, then do not make a post...

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1350829/Sky-sexism-row-Why-right-women-sexist-MEN.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/relationships/10845534/Why-is-it-only-women-who-see-sexism-everywhere.html

 

Discuss these and Loose Women.

 

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Right. 40 seconds in and I already have a mighty urge to reach through the screen and slap whoever's holding the camera for acting like such a god forsaken sexist a******.

And it's why I will never ever listen to people painting feminism as something bad, since they only appear able to scream "FREEDOM OF SPEECH, GOTTA STOP THE EVIL SHE-DEMONS FOR NO LONGER WANTING TO BE TREATED AS LESSER PEOPLE!".

 

I mean, it's right there in the definition.

Feminists are fighting for equall rights for women. That women are to be treated equall to men

 

And while I cant recall who exactly said this, it's something I verry much agree with.

"Do you think women are people? CONGRATULATIONS, YOU'RE A FEMINIST!"

 

Those going "Death to men" are a tiny but vocal minority verry much like oh I dont know, The Westborough Baptist Church is to Christianity.

 

 

You can bet your ass that had a female been disturbing something like that, organised by men, there would be ACTUALL threats of all kinds being made. And it would not be the females making those. Infact, had there been guys organising that instead at all, the same would STILL apply.

I could go on, but I'll spare everyone the rant

 

 

Before you can say feminists want equal rights, take a small thought. When did feminists EVER join up too fight for men's rights, lets say to have the same prison sentence as women, to be able to not be assumed as guilty in a court when accused of a crime against a female. Feminists are only campaigning for women's rights and that is a selfish cause, plus they break down when insulted by some loser. If you watched that video as a neutral you would have seen that they performed simple assault on him. Assault and lies, with a side order of bullying > Some irritating weirdo.

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Right. 40 seconds in and I already have a mighty urge to reach through the screen and slap whoever's holding the camera for acting like such a god forsaken sexist a******.

And it's why I will never ever listen to people painting feminism as something bad, since they only appear able to scream "FREEDOM OF SPEECH, GOTTA STOP THE EVIL SHE-DEMONS FOR NO LONGER WANTING TO BE TREATED AS LESSER PEOPLE!".

 

I mean, it's right there in the definition.

Feminists are fighting for equall rights for women. That women are to be treated equall to men

 

And while I cant recall who exactly said this, it's something I verry much agree with.

"Do you think women are people? CONGRATULATIONS, YOU'RE A FEMINIST!"

 

Those going "Death to men" are a tiny but vocal minority verry much like oh I dont know, The Westborough Baptist Church is to Christianity.

 

 

You can bet your ass that had a female been disturbing something like that, organised by men, there would be ACTUALL threats of all kinds being made. And it would not be the females making those. Infact, had there been guys organising that instead at all, the same would STILL apply.

I could go on, but I'll spare everyone the rant

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Right. 40 seconds in and I already have a mighty urge to reach through the screen and slap whoever's holding the camera for acting like such a god forsaken sexist a******.

And it's why I will never ever listen to people painting feminism as something bad, since they only appear able to scream "FREEDOM OF SPEECH, GOTTA STOP THE EVIL SHE-DEMONS FOR NO LONGER WANTING TO BE TREATED AS LESSER PEOPLE!".

 

I mean, it's right there in the definition.

Feminists are fighting for equall rights for women. That women are to be treated equall to men

 

And while I cant recall who exactly said this, it's something I verry much agree with.

"Do you think women are people? CONGRATULATIONS, YOU'RE A FEMINIST!"

 

Those going "Death to men" are a tiny but vocal minority verry much like oh I dont know, The Westborough Baptist Church is to Christianity.

 

 

You can bet your ass that had a female been disturbing something like that, organised by men, there would be ACTUALL threats of all kinds being made. And it would not be the females making those. Infact, had there been guys organising that instead at all, the same would STILL apply.

I could go on, but I'll spare everyone the rant

 

Yeeeaaaaah, see, the problem is, by that definition, virtually everyone is a feminist.  If that's all there was to it, there would be no debate. 

 

While there are very few people that actually say things like death to men, feminism, in practice, is generally a bit more involved than "Woman are people."    

 

I don't mean to use buzzwords or strawmen, but there's a certain modern/post-modern "femenist" trend that's kind of similar to social Marxism.  Westbro Baptist Church has like a hundred people in it.  That's a bit of a false equivalence. 

 

Also, 

 

 

 I will never ever listen to people painting feminism as something bad

 

 

So there you go.  I am right.  You are wrong.  Gotta stop the evil misogynists from systematically oppressing women and minorities.  

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people are absolutely disgusting.  biological determinism in no way shape or form should have an effect on how an individual, male or female, is treated throughout their lifetime, instead their worth should be based on merit... but really, our society glorifies sexism in such a way that young children are taught that these things are okay, that women are inferior to men, and so on and so forth.  yeah, there are crazy feminists, but theyre pretty much the same thing as your regular run of the mill misogynists who oppress women for, well, being women, and thats not okay on both sides.  theres no way you could sanely argue that either extremist side of that argument is right in the slightest.

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actually nobody should be allowed to hit anybody because that's absolutely stupid to think.  its never okay to hit someone unless its purely in self defense.  and, while you're saying its not okay for men to hit women, i dont actually think thats true.  look at domestic violence rates against women, or how the internet reacted to chris brown and rihanna.

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That's a large part of where I disagree with modern feminism.  I'm very skeptical of the notion that society as whole loathes women, or that people are taught to hate or look down on women.  

 

Obviously prejudice and double standards exist, and they will never go away entirely, but I am almost disturbed by the notion that people only commit violence or rape because they were never told not to.  Violence in general is obviously glorified in our culture, but to imply that we're indoctrinated with the belief that it's okay, or even cool to sexually or physically assault women is fucking ridiculous. 

 

Anecdotal evidence so it's pretty much a moot point but...

 

Abused woman.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMSb5fS5rQM  

 

Abused man.  Low quality, only one I could find.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZdddlzA2e4

 

Again, anecdotal evidence, since the implication of violence with the second one is a bit different and the acting is arguably, uh, shit. 

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it's not because they were never told not to, its because in our culture some groups perpetuate the idea that women are objects and can be raped only because they possess the opposite set of genitals.  when someone is in a group like that and has never really been taught otherwise, and doesn't have the moral structure to decide whether it's right or wrong in place, thats where the problem starts.  and dont tell me thats not disturbingly common, because it is. 

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Okay. 

 

you can say "okay" to brush off my argument as something daft or whatnot, and that's okay, but it just makes you look insanely bratty.  im not stupid, so dont treat me that way.

 

you cant deny rape culture as a whole exists; "blurred lines" by robin thicke et al is a good example of rape culture brought into the forefront.  culture as a whole sexualizes the female body, even from a very young age.  the effect of this is negative in the worst of ways, giving young women negative body image if they can't look like the girls on the front of magazines.  men, as well, are usually expected to admire the female body as opposed to the person.  why are there so many rap songs glorifying ass or whatnot?  how often have you heard a rap song by a male that wasnt about sexualizing some piece of her body?  and, if it wasnt about sexualizing some part of her body, or having to do anything with sex, was it positive?  probably not.  "baby got back" and "gold digger" are prime examples of this; two very popular songs.  the message from those sink in, whether subconsciously or directly.  people follow what other popular people do, etcetera.

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you can say "okay" to brush off my argument as something daft or whatnot, and that's okay, but it just makes you look insanely bratty.  im not stupid, so dont treat me that way.

 

you cant deny rape culture as a whole exists; "blurred lines" by robin thicke et al is a good example of rape culture brought into the forefront.  culture as a whole sexualizes the female body, even from a very young age.  the effect of this is negative in the worst of ways, giving young women negative body image if they can't look like the girls on the front of magazines.  men, as well, are usually expected to admire the female body as opposed to the person.  why are there so many rap songs glorifying ass or whatnot?  how often have you heard a rap song by a male that wasnt about sexualizing some piece of her body?  and, if it wasnt about sexualizing some part of her body, or having to do anything with sex, was it positive?  probably not.  "baby got back" and "gold digger" are prime examples of this; two very popular songs.  the message from those sink in, whether subconsciously or directly.  people follow what other popular people do, etcetera.

 

Except Baby Got Back is about positive body image.  It was All About That Bass 20 years before it.  

 

You're referring to objectifying women in the media and market as rape culture.  Yes, I will deny that.  Rape Culture is a buzzword.  It muddles the issue.   It just confuses people that aren't aware of what you're talking about.   Giving women a negative body image is not the same as teaching men to rape and murder them.  

 

Possibly related, but still a different issue.  Don't trivialize assault by attributing it to magazine covers. 

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except i wasn't stating that magazine covers were the reason for assault, instead attributing that to women having negative body image and being objectified by the media?  jeeez...  men are kind of expected to objectify women.  no one's surprised when someone sexualizes emma watson, for example, but everyone's like gasp when daniel radcliffe is sexualized.  this ties into our conversation because, if women are constantly objectified, men will have no problems seeing them as something only explicitly sexual, which could be a factor in rape.  and it does happen, and it is widespread, and it happens way more than you think.  still, every case is different, but culture as a whole glorifies the sexualization of the female body, rape or not, and that undoubtedly has an effect on the whole thing.

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So. Time for CowCow's general opinion on feminism.

It doesn't really matter how some people of a group are acting in the long run. The important thing is to focus on the goal, the positives, and push the negatives to the side. We can't advance by continuously going off on the bad side of it. Yes, it's wrong what some extremists do. But, that doesn't detract from the point.

And the point is, people need to be treated as people. No matter what. Tenta is a person, Swan is a person, both of you are people who are entitled to your opinions as long as they don't harm anyone, regardless of your gender.

 

Also, I don't care who you are, hitting people is wrong no matter the who it is. Unless in self-defense. The main reason "men hitting women" is considered worse is because, physically, women are less muscular and more...frail (just in general). Now if a woman beats the crap outta a guy yeah that is bad. No one should argue that. But a fact is that it's often seen the other way around because of physical differences

 

But sexism and discrimination exists on both sides. It's wrong, but we can't truly change how those people feel. If they are so far gone they can't see that, it's pointless to argue because everything will go over their heads. We can however lessen the importance of those people's words.

Media does objectify women, true. And it seems it's more often than men. Though it IS true I've seen it the other way before. That's the problem, never try to make an issue more seen and such by lessening another.

Do NOT compare, that is the fault nearly ever single person has. You can't compare because they are different things, and you shouldn't compare because comparing them only serves to make one issue seem not as important, it doesn't really help your cause.

 

Now that's a rant...Well didn't think I'd be doing that first thing today.

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Sounds like this thread needs some examples of neo-feminism.
Using this because it gives the details necessary on the campaign. Best described as "Using Feminism to suppress campaign opponents"
http://legalinsurrection.com/2011/11/the-pushback-against-sharon-bialek-begins/
Oddly, the word of the cases' progress disappeared the week he dropped out of the presidential race. Sounds like neo-feminism.
Transphobia in Feminism
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/08/04/woman-2
Don't forget the Feminist that believe domestic abuse against men doesn't exist
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/jun/07/feminism-domestic-violence-men
Let's not forget the "facts"
http://www.feminist.org/911/crisis_facts.html

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I pretty much agree with the bovine, BUT

 

I disagree that's it's as simple as "pushing aside the extremists."  There are prevalent ideas and opinions that are commonly associated with feminism that I strongly disagree with.  Saying "But that's a minority of feminists," or, "That doesn't really exist," doesn't really help.

 

I'm disagreeing with ideas.  It doesn't mean I'm referring to anyone who identifies as a feminist.  I don't even agree with writing off people as crazy extremists.  

 

Bill Clinton recently gave a speech on the toxicity of gender politics.  It's not just some crazy feminists who hate men.  I mean, that exists too, but there's a greater social ideology that does exist.  I don't want to use the word Social Justice Warrior, but there really isn't another word for it other than maybe Third Wave Feminist.  

 

It's more common than some people make it out to be.  And look, I don't want to sound like I'm trying to witch hunt, those opinions can be heard, I just disagree with them.  There's a certain trend I've been seeing where when you disagree with these ideas people back into, "Well excuse me for thinking women are people!"

 

 

Anyway, I'm just incoherently rambling now.  

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Sounds like this thread needs some examples of neo-feminism.
Using this because it gives the details necessary on the campaign. Best described as "Using Feminism to suppress campaign opponents"
http://legalinsurrection.com/2011/11/the-pushback-against-sharon-bialek-begins/
Oddly, the word of the cases' progress disappeared the week he dropped out of the presidential race. Sounds like neo-feminism.
Transphobia in Feminism
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/08/04/woman-2
Don't forget the Feminist that believe domestic abuse against men doesn't exist
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/jun/07/feminism-domestic-violence-men
Let's not forget the "facts"
http://www.feminist.org/911/crisis_facts.html

 

Wow this is awesome. Some women actually agree with problems with certain feminism. Take that Lazarus!

 

Anyway women did fight for decades and whatever, but men fought for MILLENNIA to earn there frigging precious rights! So some feminists just went around holding signs and now they think they went through worse than men? Atrocious! So what, you protested but still it was mainly men who earned you your rights. Men who got us these forums for you to squeal on. Plus women can start domestic violence and as long as MTV is still saying 'Abuse towards women by men" and the media carry on vomiting desperate male stereotypes, the UK an the USA will not be an equal society. Emma is a nice feminist, I think she is awesome. I like feminists who understand men's suffering...

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