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[Sakura] The era of revolution has now begun (Lightning Strike Revolution Dragon) [20K post]

- - - - - sakura single level 8 synchro 20k post

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#1
Flash Flyer - Sakura

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1 Dragon-Type Tuner + 1 or more non-Tuner Dragon-Type monsters
If this card is the only monster you control, it can make a second attack during each Battle Phase. When this card destroys an opponent's monster by battle: Your opponent takes 600 damage.

 

(V2.1)

 

V2

 

V1

 

As you can probably guess, this marks my 20,000th post on YCM, so an RC card is most fitting.

(Coincidentally, I'm also 20; but I'll just skip to the explanation instead of speaking about correlations)

 

Basically a double attacker if you have another Dragon out (which will probably be most of the time), burns your opponent when it kills something and offers protection from destruction/card effects [from your opponent's side].

 

I did have the burn effect go for the ATK, but quickly said no on the idea considering this can strike twice, and more or less strip half your opponent's LP on its own from burning. Hitting the Level/Ranks is still harsh, especially against bosses, but not nearly as severe (it'll still hurt in conjunction with the attacks)

 

 

IMG Credit: http://i825.photobuc...sgtxtgtrsht.png

(It came from JazinKay's album, much like the 19k post card was)

 

 

So yeah, please CnC.

Reps will be given for proper reviews.

 

(And by no means is this supposed to be related to Dark Rebellion or whatever)


Edited by Sakura Haruno, 09 December 2014 - 02:26 AM.
Gave the 2x attack back, but only if it's alone on the field; burn damage has been slightly reduced.

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#2
Minato Sakai

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its phantom blaster overlord. the card is nice. the burn isn't too strong. the double attack can lead to otks. would be better if it was like bls's double attacking effect. 


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#3
Flash Flyer - Sakura

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The weak burn is more or less there to compensate for its ability to attack twice, especially on a 3k body.

I had contemplated making it 200 instead, but that would be pushing it to some extent against several high Level/Rank bosses (would result in 1000-1600 damage as additional).

 

With that said, making it use BLS's double attacking effect would be more beneficial to it; since it just needs to kill something instead of requiring another Dragon on the field [though as mentioned, you'll probably have another one].

 

Or I could just take off the restriction and let it hit twice regardless, although again, a double attacker on a 3000 ATK body is scary to face; especially with burn, so hesitant on doing so.


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#4
Cosmo.

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I really like it, it sort of reminds me of a dragon six samurai, because of the having another dragon to get more effs and defending other dragons.

The OCG is FLAWLESS, and the artwork is nice, i'm not a big fan of dragons but this card gets a 10/10 :)



#5
Flash Flyer - Sakura

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In a way, it is similar to a 6Sam, but only for it to be able to strike twice.

Even if it's alone, it's perfectly capable of doing enough damage on its own + protecting.

 

Having the extra monster ensures that it can't go overboard and kill nearly everything in its path. Last time I checked, most bosses are 2800ish or something, so this card can run them over.

 

I suppose you could consider it as another Dragon boss; not that they really need another one, factoring in support and all that.

Making it a Wyrm wouldn't really work, flavor-wise, but that was an option.


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#6
Saiba Aisu

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Sakura, this is a really excellent card! The OCG is flawless and also the naming choice / aesthetic of the card is completely on point. You've earned yourself a perfect rating for this. 10/10!


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#7
Flash Flyer - Sakura

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Thanks.

Anything in particular you liked about the card?

 

(Because of the Advanced Clause, you need to say something specific about the card. Did you like how I designed the effect or something along those lines?)


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#8
Saiba Aisu

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Oh, didn't know this, I guess focusing on the aesthetic/OCG is not enough. Well the effect in and of itself is pretty nice and provides support to Dragons, which are generally pretty easy to fit into most Decks. It's actually quite a powerful card - not many monsters are able to stand up to a 3000 beatstick that's going to be able to attack twice most turns and also inflict burn damage on the side. Still, it's still vulnerable to non-targeting destruction effects like Mirror Force or Torrential Tribute, or even ones that banish/return it to the Extra Deck/switch control of it, so that's a balancing factor for sure.


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#9
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*clears throat violently*

*adjusts book*

This card is dumb.

It's an easier to summon version of Trident Dragion in a lot of decks, and that card is already an unfair design that just steals games.

You must remember, when designing, it is not in a vaccuum. This card ignores Dragon Rulers existing, and while they're no top deck anymore, they're still very relevant in design.

If you have a DRuler + Flamvell Guard, you make this. You can then plop another dragon on the board to have a 3K double swinger that burns to boot. That's an OTK for Tempest/Tidal + Blaster/Flamvell + Redox. Two of that combo are limited (not counting Blaster search), but Dragon Shrine exists, and it's still a design point that should be acknowledged.

This also works with DRuler + Debris Dragon w/Guard in grave, though that's not as likely to kill.

Now, let's move onto something perhaps more terrifying. Hieratics.

TEfnuit + 2 Hieratics (at least one su) = This w/Gaia Dragon on board. SS Tefnuit, tribute it for Su/Nep (iirc), get Vanilla Level 6. Tribute that one for another, get Galaxy Serpent. Overlay Vanilla and Level 6, make Atum, fetch REDRUM/another Level 6. Sync for 8 with Serpent/Level 6 you got from Atum/REDRUM. Overlay Gaia on Atum. You have 8600 on the board, with both burn and piercing to help finish the game.

Making it straight BLS would be even more unfair, as that removes the tiny amount of effort needed for the double swing.

It then has a TRA-esque protection effect as icing on top.

It rewards you far too much for not a ton of effort. The double swing shouldn't even be there, because effects like that are prone to ending games too quickly, especially on big cards like this.

Also, I really dislike that you used a blatantly evil dragon as a light lightning dragon, even with the lightning in the art. Speaks ill of the design to use somethign as blatantly opposite while making an effect that seems like a different card (Dragonic Overlords) than the card in the art altogether, despite it being an homage. =x


#10
Flash Flyer - Sakura

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Oh, didn't know this, I guess focusing on the aesthetic/OCG is not enough. Well the effect in and of itself is pretty nice and provides support to Dragons, which are generally pretty easy to fit into most Decks. It's actually quite a powerful card - not many monsters are able to stand up to a 3000 beatstick that's going to be able to attack twice most turns and also inflict burn damage on the side. Still, it's still vulnerable to non-targeting destruction effects like Mirror Force or Torrential Tribute, or even ones that banish/return it to the Extra Deck/switch control of it, so that's a balancing factor for sure.

 

Yeah, it's more or less to allow you to give some form of critique on what should be fixed so I can improve on it.

Below, Black has essentially torn it apart for certain things.

 

Granted though, it's essentially a 6k attacker in its own right for most intents/purposes.

While it might be weak to Mirror Force, Exciton and other things, it does a lot.

 

*clears throat violently*

*adjusts book*

This card is dumb.

It's an easier to summon version of Trident Dragion in a lot of decks, and that card is already an unfair design that just steals games.

You must remember, when designing, it is not in a vaccuum. This card ignores Dragon Rulers existing, and while they're no top deck anymore, they're still very relevant in design.

If you have a DRuler + Flamvell Guard, you make this. You can then plop another dragon on the board to have a 3K double swinger that burns to boot. That's an OTK for Tempest/Tidal + Blaster/Flamvell + Redox. Two of that combo are limited (not counting Blaster search), but Dragon Shrine exists, and it's still a design point that should be acknowledged.

This also works with DRuler + Debris Dragon w/Guard in grave, though that's not as likely to kill.

Now, let's move onto something perhaps more terrifying. Hieratics.

TEfnuit + 2 Hieratics (at least one su) = This w/Gaia Dragon on board. SS Tefnuit, tribute it for Su/Nep (iirc), get Vanilla Level 6. Tribute that one for another, get Galaxy Serpent. Overlay Vanilla and Level 6, make Atum, fetch REDRUM/another Level 6. Sync for 8 with Serpent/Level 6 you got from Atum/REDRUM. Overlay Gaia on Atum. You have 8600 on the board, with both burn and piercing to help finish the game.

Making it straight BLS would be even more unfair, as that removes the tiny amount of effort needed for the double swing.

It then has a TRA-esque protection effect as icing on top.

It rewards you far too much for not a ton of effort. The double swing shouldn't even be there, because effects like that are prone to ending games too quickly, especially on big cards like this.

Also, I really dislike that you used a blatantly evil dragon as a light lightning dragon, even with the lightning in the art. Speaks ill of the design to use somethign as blatantly opposite while making an effect that seems like a different card (Dragonic Overlords) than the card in the art altogether, despite it being an homage. =x

 

I essentially ripped the picture off of JazinKay's album as noted earlier, so if it was a Vanguard thing (or whatever series it came from), I wouldn't know.

 

But yes, the double attack is a lot [and I had forgotten about Rulers to some degree + Dragion while designing].

Compared to Dragion, as noted, it's easier to summon + guaranteed two attacks provided another monster exists; whereas Dragion tributes cards + only gets the extra attacks that turn.

 

The burn should be fine (although a bit menial at this point), but the double attacking effect should go as mentioned.

As for the last effect, I'll think of an alternative for it [either make it less of Thought Ruler's effect (which has a higher LP than what this card uses), or just get rid of it altogether]. For now, the latter option.

 

So in essence, reduced to just burning the opponent when it kills something; though it's a set 800 LP burn, regardless of Level/Rank.

I would have increased the damage to 200 x Level/Rank, but that would result in a lot more damage than it's worth; especially against higher Level/Rank things.

 

That being said, I could've made this require LIGHT monsters, but they already got Light End and various other support cards in Honest and whatever else.

 

If it means anything, I dropped its ATK slightly to 2800. While RDA + other things can run it over now, it should have enough ATK to hold its own in other cases.

 

 

 

So yeah, thanks for the CnC, both of you; especially Black.

(On a somewhat relevant note, I am playtesting Hieratics on DevPro, but more or less a Ritual version of it instead of the standard REDMD builds.)


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#11
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Incredible picture, awe-inspiring really. As expected from JazinKay, he has excellent taste and his contribution to YCM just keeps on giving. 

 

The current effect is underpowered (you could leave it as it without being unrealistic though, Lightning Warrior seems similarly underpowered for the times but this does require type-specific materials) and the former effect is overpowered as mentioned earlier. Longer effects allow you to introduce more complexity too, so having another Dragon present as its condition seems counterintuitive as it would exacerbate swarm issues and stack a benefit on a benefit, it'd probably be better for it to be able to attack again if it were alone. I'd agree with Khanate that a second attack should also be provided only after this has destroyed a monster in battle already. You could take a whole other direction with it too, as it is the effect seems a little underpowered and basic though (which is understandable in recognition of earlier criticism). 



#12
Flash Flyer - Sakura

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First incarnate was pushing it A LOT, this one is basically a sizable amount of burn when it destroys something.

 

I probably could give it a Flame Wingman sort of effect; when it kills something, your opponent gets hit for that monster's ATK.

But giving it back the double attacking effect is an option, assuming it's alone on the field.

 

Though if that's the case, I'll have to retain its current burn effect at 800, because we don't need to deal massive amounts of damage solely from burn damage (2 attacks).

 

In some cases, keeping things simple is a good thing, especially on a boss monster of sorts.

 

Suppose I could return the second effect, but limit it only during one player's turn; not give it free reign. (Or I make the cost actually balance out the effect of protecting another Dragon; would say banish but that would make something bad with Wyvern and a bunch of other stuff).

 

So I'm left with the following options:

 

- Change its damage effect to burn the opponent's ATK as damage + have it attack once.

- Allow it to strike twice while alone + retain the current damage effect.

- Add back the old third effect, but nerf it so it's not a Dragon ripoff of Thought Ruler + give a better cost than LP.

 

 

Hmm, I'll need to consider it a bit; but if I want to keep it plain and simple, first one might be better.


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#13
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First incarnate was pushing it A LOT

 

I agree and don't mean to suggest returning to the original, but rather a golden mean between that and the current version.

 

Speaking of Dragon Rulers though (since Robin brought them up), they as an Archetype adhered about as badly the game's balance precedents as the initial version of this would now and they'll go down as one of Konami's worst crimes against balance ever (thankfully they were deservedly hit hard by the ban list as a result). I'm not sure how relevant they should be considered in dictating how Realistic Cards should be balanced as I'm a bit out of touch with current balance standards myself, but I'd suspect that a consideration of Dragon Ruler Archetype standards as "not very relevant" would produce the most cohesive results. 

 

 


In some cases, keeping things simple is a good thing

 

This is very true, most effects in the game don't exceed one or two lines, although a replication of that theme would compromise some of the art and fun involved in making cards.
 



#14
Flash Flyer - Sakura

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I think a double attacking effect while it's alone should be okay; considering the art chosen here more or less would imply such a thing. 

Considering the effort needed to bring this out, can probably do a lot better than simply burning the opponent when something gets killed.

 

As for Dragon Rulers, I seem to recall that their design lead to Rank 7 monsters being discouraged a bit earlier on; mainly due to 11 / Dracossack being prevalent at the time.

But yeah, some of Konami's designs essentially mean that something similar cannot be done, without inadvertently giving bad cards even more support to wreak havoc.

 

Rulers are still run in a few other Decks; I'm personally using Tempest for MPB things + Tidal in some outdated Ice Barrier deck on YGOPro and DN; but that's about it. (I know LS have a build that utilize them; how they get used, idk since not familiar with it)


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#15
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I agree and don't mean to suggest returning to the original, but rather a golden mean between that and the current version.

Speaking of Dragon Rulers though (since Robin brought them up), they as an Archetype adhered about as badly the game's balance precedents as the initial version of this would now and they'll go down as one of Konami's worst crimes against balance ever (thankfully they were deservedly hit hard by the ban list as a result). I'm not sure how relevant they should be considered in dictating how Realistic Cards should be balanced as I'm a bit out of touch with current balance standards myself, but I'd suspect that a consideration of Dragon Ruler Archetype standards as "not very relevant" would produce the most cohesive results.

They're not relevant nowadays. They're elemental techs/lightsworn cards for the most part, due to the game outpacing them.

The idea is that they still provide an easy means to making this (Dragon Shrine is effectively a searcher, Guard/Debris are searchable, etc.), and as such should be considered when making a card with such a high reward for a cost that can be so easily mitigated with fairly average setup overall.

They are abominations in both design and balance, but they're all the more reason to point out that this is flawed, considering that they aren't relevant anymore. It's still a boss that's a bit too good for the effort (swinging alone is still not a good idea, really. Make it BLS-esque while alone.), even if it is in a set of cards that isn't good anymore.

If compared to Qlips and shit it's not offensive, but those are hardly what you want to be basing your design upon.


#16
Darj

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In my opinion the card feels too weak now.

Yes, it is a "full aggro" card that can potentially inflict tons of damage, but now that it must be alone on the field to apply its effect, it feels underwhelming; the base ATK drop doesn't help either. I mean, the card is good for stealing games, but I think that, more often than not, it would be better or safer to go for 1 of the Stardust Dragons, Scrap Dragon or Hot Red Dragon instead to deal with any backrow or monsters the opponent may control.

 

Since it is not generic, I think it can afford to be at least slightly better than the aforementioned generic Synchro8s. I understand that it shouldn't be too strong because Rulers are a thing, but in my opinion that doesn't mean it should be outclassed or overshadowed by other existing cards, especially when this requires more specific materials.

Personally, I would:

- Bring the original protection effect back.

- Retain the "while this card is alone, it can attack twice". Possibly further nerf it with a BLS clause: attack again if it destroys a monster by battle.

- Remove the burning effect.

 

That way, it would be more of a Stardust Spark Dragon with higher ATK and an additional perk, and kind of a "Qliphort Shell" that doesn't pierce.


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#17
Flash Flyer - Sakura

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That much, I can do.

Might as well restore it to 3000 ATK.

 

It proves difficult to design a decent Dragon-Type Extra Deck monster when we have Rulers to worry about; so it really decreases the amount of things that can be done.

 

 

So, give the original protection back [with a better cost] and give it the BLS/Ruin effect (it can attack again if it destroys something).

More often than not, it'll probably kill something and trigger again; even if nerfed.


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