[INOV] Starve Venom Fusion Dragon

[VCR_CAT]

my points are based on present yugioh overall

 

scarlight is niche, pluto is not realistic, and so on.

 

It has very few quality targets for the 2, and the other effects aren't exactly amazing.

 

Well, I consider the 2 effect to be icing on the cake more than anything. If you have an opportunity to use it well, then it's fantastic; but the primary use pretty much is to beat face a little harder; and considering it grabs those sick gains without targeting, I'd say it does so very well and becomes almost the UTL for the decks that can't UTL. Y'know, besides the lack of an Armades effect.

[evilfusion]

I feel like Starve Venom isn't supposed to be the "boss" monster in strategies that can use it. It seems more like an answer, the way Dark Rebellion is used more as an answer to something than as a standalone "I Summon this as the point of my strategy". Odd-Eyes and Clear Wing are more monsters you bring out proactively. Dark Rebellion and Starve Venom are more reactive, to swing momentum in your favor by turning a defensive situation into a push of aggression.

[Expelsword]

My only question is if you can use your opponent's monsters on the field.

I'm assuming you can't.

[Blake]

I mean, argue this is like DRXD all you want, but the fact remains that this is a DRXD that requires a 3rd card and/or trump girl to make.

 

That's not exactly amazing, though the trump girl use is fine.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

It's kinda shocking that OCG continues to make near-generic fusions (first Metalphosis), but leaves Super Poly at 1.

 

I guess this card can be pretty damn cool with Dragon's Mirror though. There's enough decks that load up on Darks in the grave for it to be a neatish tech

[Dragulas]

It's kinda shocking that OCG continues to make near-generic fusions (first Metalphosis), but leaves Super Poly at 1.

 

I guess this card can be pretty damn cool with Dragon's Mirror though. There's enough decks that load up on Darks in the grave for it to be a neatish tech

The materials need to be on the field, dragons mirror cannot optimze its requirements, at that point even fusion substitue seems better than even poly.

[evilfusion]

My only question is if you can use your opponent's monsters on the field.

I'm assuming you can't.

 

You can if you have an effect that lets you use your opponent's monsters. Super Poly can SS this, for example.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

My only question is if you can use your opponent's monsters on the field.

I'm assuming you can't.

Doubtful, Chimeratech Fortress Dragon specifically says you can use from either field, this, as of now, does not

The materials need to be on the field, dragons mirror cannot optimze its requirements, at that point even fusion substitue seems better than even poly.

Oh, that's so weird, have never seen that clause on a card before

 

I assumed that it meant the monsters have to be dark on the field, but yuck, black's right, this card does require a little too much for what it provides

 

I guess it could be a cute super poly tech against a dark heavy meta

[VCR_CAT]

I mean, argue this is like DRXD all you want, but the fact remains that this is a DRXD that requires a 3rd card and/or trump girl to make.

 

That's not exactly amazing, though the trump girl use is fine.

 

Except not really. Dark Rebellion's sick gains effect requires that it targets a monster, and beyond that, affects it. Dark Rebellion is most useful as a means of dealing more damage in a given turn than as a boss buster; and you should know this. Starve Venom, beyond being a highly generic fusion for a lot of decks that are either unable to play Rank 4 cards or need to jump through a lot of hoops to do so, neither targets nor needs to affect any monsters besides itself in order to gain its ATK; I would honestly be more quick to equate this to UTL than Dark Rebellion for those reasons.

 

I'm not saying this is the most amazing thing since sliced bread; but it offers something that a lot of decks are actually completely without. The game has been getting more and more fat monsters with strong protection (Kozmos, Chaos MAX, Ultimate Ruri, Magnus, etc.) and while a lot of these are not a part of the meta game now or even yet, that still doesn't mean a deck can necessarily get away without having a Fat Body as a means to out these.

 

Starve's incredibly generic, and cards such as Fusion Substitute and Flash Fusion become hardly a stretch for a deck to run that's able to barf out at least 2 darks in a turn with little cost or need. I mean, consider that BAPK is a deck that's unable to really breach over 3K without the need of external cards to assist, and while the RUM will help them get over larger monsters, there's still the issue of Towers situations that they absolutely cannot answer otherwise.

 

So, Starve's not AMAZING per se, but it's pretty decent and covers a niche for a lot of decks that they otherwise have not filled.

 

 

Also seriously; Flash Fusion people. D/D's are probably going to have a fair amount of fun with that.

[Maeriberii Haan]

just a nitpick, while it counts as external cards, PK's S/Ts helps them break 3.5 or 4k easily, and they're used as such too, mainly relevant against Magnus back when SQ was a strong rogue pick.

[Blake]

Except not really. Dark Rebellion's sick gains effect requires that it targets a monster, and beyond that, affects it. Dark Rebellion is most useful as a means of dealing more damage in a given turn than as a boss buster; and you should know this. Starve Venom, beyond being a highly generic fusion for a lot of decks that are either unable to play Rank 4 cards or need to jump through a lot of hoops to do so, neither targets nor needs to affect any monsters besides itself in order to gain its ATK; I would honestly be more quick to equate this to UTL than Dark Rebellion for those reasons.

 

I'm not saying this is the most amazing thing since sliced bread; but it offers something that a lot of decks are actually completely without. The game has been getting more and more fat monsters with strong protection (Kozmos, Chaos MAX, Ultimate Ruri, Magnus, etc.) and while a lot of these are not a part of the meta game now or even yet, that still doesn't mean a deck can necessarily get away without having a Fat Body as a means to out these.

 

Starve's incredibly generic, and cards such as Fusion Substitute and Flash Fusion become hardly a stretch for a deck to run that's able to barf out at least 2 darks in a turn with little cost or need. I mean, consider that BAPK is a deck that's unable to really breach over 3K without the need of external cards to assist, and while the RUM will help them get over larger monsters, there's still the issue of Towers situations that they absolutely cannot answer otherwise.

 

So, Starve's not AMAZING per se, but it's pretty decent and covers a niche for a lot of decks that they otherwise have not filled.

 

Also seriously; Flash Fusion people. D/D's are probably going to have a fair amount of fun with that.

But what overlap is there? Dark but can't run 4s? The only thing I can think of is D/D... and they can make Crystal Wing, which outs a number of the Towers monsters/Kozmo, anyway.

 

EDIT: Obv PK/BA, but given the two are often hybridized, there is potential for 4.

 

Yes, you'll run this in Trump Girl pendulum builds because versatility, but that doesn't change that the card is, overall, mediocre. It's just not good in the current gamestate, and being a 1-shot out to Kozmo isn't exactly astounding.

 

At least it outs Azure, I guess?

 

Flash Fusion and Fusion Substitute are really bad arguments. Like, decks don't run Dragon's Mirror because they run zombies/vanillas, so why would they do so for a summon that WILL cost them a -2 or more? Maybe it's fine in BA, but aside from BA, that seems terrible.

 

Flash Fusion is still a bad card, especially in a deck like D/D that needs all the consistency it can get.

[VCR_CAT]

just a nitpick, while it counts as external cards, PK's S/Ts helps them break 3.5 or 4k easily, and they're used as such too, mainly relevant against Magnus back when SQ was a strong rogue pick.

 

Well, I wasn't keeping that out of consideration; but it's worth pointing out that Starve requires much less setup than relying on those plays in order to out those cards.

[Maeriberii Haan]

It basically boils down to:

 

fast answer vs reliable answer

 

you can run things that search poly/sub to get starve out more consistently but those eat deck slots while the PK S/Ts are searchable so you can run less of them and still get them reliably, but the good ones are traps usually so they're slow.

[VCR_CAT]

It basically boils down to:

 

fast answer vs reliable answer

 

you can run things that search poly/sub to get starve out more consistently but those eat deck slots while the PK S/Ts are searchable so you can run less of them and still get them reliably, but the good ones are traps usually so they're slow.

 

I do maintain the opinion that it's an easy option to run that brings some solid use to the deck; either for pushing for more damage or for removing high-value boss targets. And still; Flash Fuuussiiiooonnn

[Dragulas]

Would starve venom be able to copy the effects of towers (or other unaffected monsters)?, though is unaffected, it still can be targeted and it does nothing to it, or it cant?

[Kaiji]

Would starve venom be able to copy the effects of towers (or other unaffected monsters)?, though is unaffected, it still can be targeted and it does nothing to it, or it cant?

It should be able to since immunity doesn't prevent you from being targeted only that effects won't apply on the card (which isn;t the case since you are just copying the name + effs).

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Um, looking it over again, Super Poly seems to be a really good side in vs Phantom Abyss now. Stopping the Break Floats and being able to crack the Cir Loop all seem pretty good.

 

It's also a lot less conditional than super poly to make Pilgrim

 

Edit: Fusion Subsitute could actully be decent (esp if you're running the Instant Fusion build) to minimized the fusion cards you have to run. Even if you mill it, a free +1 off Pilgrim isn't awful

[Darj]

My first thought was that you could be pro and tech Dragon's Mirror in every DARK deck now to Summon this, but after the comments I noticed the "on the field" clause in its material requirements; what a bummer. Regardless, I like this card for its combination of effects, including that effect-copy that could lead to funny plays, and its material requirements; it is ought to see play in some decks and builds, as the aforementioned Trump Witch.

[Fluffyfish]

The card feels pretty good, specially having in mind how generic it is (thanks for making it 2 DARK konami! Love ya!). Although I'm just wondering if the "non-token" clause was actually necessary (I guess because Scapeghost? or Fusion Gate?).

The best ways to do it are by using both Trump Girl and Fusion Substitute (both which makes the summon a -1 at worst), and you should at least be able to destroy all SS'ed monsters your opp controls. The first effect feels really good, since it can go through anything by battle the turn its summoned (thank god for no-targeting), probably dealing 2.8k dmg in the process. The 2nd effect feels a bit circumstantial (I'd say it normally won't be useful, but it definitely can save you in some scenarios). All in all, I'd say its third effect is probably the best, since its 1st is only alive 1 turn and the 2nd may not even be alive at all, but having in mind what the card offers as a whole (a beater, an effect steal and a revenge destruction), I think the card is pretty good and reliable in most scenarios, and is definitely worth using in many decks (some just need to add a Trump Girl to them and voila! Xyz Scum!).

[Βyakuya]

The artwork is as sexy as the dimension boy using it.

 

As a card overall, it's pretty decent all around. Despite being somewhat generic with DARKs, it does require you to summon from the field so that you don't make the fusion requirement more beneficial. The Summon ignition effect does not target a monster, so it can get over pretty much any Towers monster that's in your way. Second effect to copy an effect seems pretty neat but the applications for it seem limited in the current metagame. If Dracopals weren't slaughtered in OCG, Ignister would be marvelous to have its effect taken. But it cannot target Xyzs like Break Sword and there are not much boss monsters with Spell Speed 1 effects left on the field or ones that matter such as Azure or Spirit. Something like Siegfried or Orihulk might work or Crystal Wing if you bait it but it might be more lethal in the future. Nuke on destruction effect is cute.

 

This card is pretty much digging a deeper grave for Super Poly in TCG, but the only realistic use of this is in Odd-Eyes.dek in OCG considering Trump Witch. Super Poly can be used against PK Fire to disrupt a Break Sword play, but in the end you end up with a mediocre 2.8k beater that helps them float if it dies, so it only becomes an inconvenience instead of a threat. Since Metalphose already runs Super Poly, they can fusion Gofu and/or its token to make it. 

 

Overall, its a very a good Fusion monster with some balanced power but is not currently super effective now and might have some potential lethal use in the future when decks can tech Poly or fusion methods easier. While it does somewhat topple over the other Dimension Dragons, Clear/Crystal still are more superior in my eyes. They're more generic and have powerful negation effects that beat over this, but at least Starve has the nuke effect to balance it out.

[玄魔の王]

So, how did we end up with these summon conditions on SVFD?

2 reasons. First, since all three of its counterparts were generic, they had to make this one as generic as possible to fit the theme. Hence they went all the way back to just Attributes. However, that's potentially broken, so they had to counterbalance it.

Which leads to the second: all 3 other Dimension Dragons default to needing 2(+) cards on the field: Scales, 2 LV4s and Tuner + non-Tuner respectively. Hence, 2 Fusion Materials on the field.

How amusing that the Plant Dragon is designed around flavour.

[Toffee.]

Hey, you know....

 

This card likely needs DARK monsters for Fusion Materials because Odd-Eyes Pend Dragon is DARK.

(Aside from the fact Pred Plants are DARK)

[Blake]

One is WIND
One is maindeck

One has 300 more ATK

One has no Level

 

each of the dragons have 1 unique aspect, barring the fact that this has non-generic requirements. So now we know how the cycle is complete.

 

Granted, I find it weird.

 

DRXD is based on Dark Mist, which makes sense.

CWSD is based on Stardust.

SVFD is based on... Vennominaga?

[玄魔の王]

Hey, you know....

 

This card likely needs DARK monsters for Fusion Materials because Odd-Eyes Pend Dragon is DARK.

(Aside from the fact Pred Plants are DARK)

As are Yuya's Magicians (several of them anyway). And a couple of his P-Pals.

 

And Yuto's Phantom Knights and Xyz Dragons.

 

Really Yugo is the only one it doesn't gel with, for obvious reasons.

[Aerion Brightflame]

I can't think of a single GX monster that this is linked to like Clear Wing or Dark Rebellion. 

 

It feels like (In effects), it's closest to Genome Herieter than anything that was in GX. I don't think the 'I negate your effect, claim it and your name for my own, existed before ZeXal. 

 

It's weird. I would have assumed it's effect would be based on one of the big GX villians, or at least a supporting character, since we have Tertiary antagonist, Protagonist and then...? Especially since 2800 attack is usually the attack value of a side characters ace, like Crow or Chazz or Shark. 

 

Visually it might be taking after Yubel though instead of Venominaga.