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#281
Z-ARC

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i mean, the problem cards are Innervate, Spreading Plague, and Ultimate Infestation

 

SP and Innervate moreso than UI.

 

SP completely covers the biggest weakness of the deck, while UI helps you maintain through the game past the point that is meant to be the drawback to ramp. Innervate is just too good for what it does, and it should probably simply RESTORE 2 mana.

 

also making jade idol 2 mana makes it immune to le sick skulking geist drop



#282
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i mean, the problem cards are Innervate, Spreading Plague, and Ultimate Infestation
 
SP and Innervate moreso than UI.
 
SP completely covers the biggest weakness of the deck, while UI helps you maintain through the game past the point that is meant to be the drawback to ramp. Innervate is just too good for what it does, and it should probably simply RESTORE 2 mana.
 
also making jade idol 2 mana makes it immune to le sick skulking geist drop


Right, I forgot to mention making UI's numbers 4.

I think between the cards I named and the cards you did Plague is the smallest issue (though still a pretty big issue). For that making them token 1/4s works.

Innervate is hard to nerf it and keep the card stay the same functionally. Only real option is to make it get 1 free.

The fact that changing Idol to 2 makes Geist do nothing is REAL bad. Maybe make it only shuffle 2 to make you need to shuffle more.

Also, Nourish could have the mana not be active the turn you use it.

Regardless of what the change, Druid is in such a powerful place right now. It has both very powerful ramp and very powerful card draw and those are incredibly stupid together. The fact that it has so much survivability between the armor and taunt options makes it even worse. Druid literally has everything and you can do so much to nerf the cards and still have it be powerful.
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#283
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you are the first person i've seen that doesn't say spreading plague, because a hoard of 1/5s that protect you from aggro is a pretty big deal for a deck that would otherwise suffer in the face of aggro

 

innervate can be nerfed to simply restore and then it doesn't serve to ramp you super fast, and it's not like the HS team cares about keeping things functionally the same, as shown time and again

 

nourish is honestly fine, not even close to the problem card(s). there's nothing wrong with unfair cards, it's a core part of game design, and it doesn't dip into broken



#284
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you are the first person i've seen that doesn't say spreading plague, because a hoard of 1/5s that protect you from aggro is a pretty big deal for a deck that would otherwise suffer in the face of aggro
 
innervate can be nerfed to simply restore and then it doesn't serve to ramp you super fast, and it's not like the HS team cares about keeping things functionally the same, as shown time and again
 
nourish is honestly fine, not even close to the problem card(s). there's nothing wrong with unfair cards, it's a core part of game design, and it doesn't dip into broken


Plague is certainly problematic, but I believe the ramp+card draw combo is what has allowed Druid to become so insanely powerful. Thats part of why I feel Nourish is something they could hit. That being said, N is certainly the least problematic and as you said powerful cards are part of any game.

I do believe they try to keep the functionality of cards when they can, just powered down. However they really don't have a lot of room with Innervate and your change is something I can see them doing.
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#285
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Yeah, all 77 players had Druid in their EU HCT lineups. Pretty crazy.

 

I think Spreading Plague is just about the biggest problem, it completely shores up Druids weaknesses of aggro and wide boards. 5 health on those taunts is too much.

 

UI is fine, 10 mana spells should be that good. The problem is Druids getting that shit out on turn 5 just when they need to refresh their hand from using all that ramp.


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#286
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Holy shit I wasn't expecting this: https://us.battle.ne...ate-91-9-5-2017

 

I don't really like the FWA nerf, this is gonna stamp out what few Control Warrior players are left, and for the #1 weapon class in Hearthstone, their identity weapon is now strictly worse than the multitude of 3 mana 3/2 weapons out there including their own King's Defender (hell, now they're no longer the best at both armor gain and weapons). I also don't think Spreading Plague got hit enough, 5 health is still too much for those tokens. I don't think this'll really change the power level of Druid that much, Jade Idol still is and will continue to be a problem as long as it continues kill heavy control decks. The Warleader one is pretty good, though, and the Innervate and Hex ones are fine I guess.


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#287
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Agree that the Axe nerf is a huge blow for control Warrior. Pirates needed something to be done, but something more pinpoint.

I feel just nerfing Innervate and Plague isn't enough. As I was saying before, on a fundamental level the problem with Druid is that it can play a million ramp spells and then refill which such powerful card draw. This hurts it, but it will likely still be a tier 1 deck. Especially with one of the best aggro decks also being hit.

The Hex change just seems SUPER random.

The bit on Warleader is interesting to me
"For example, in its current state, having a Murloc Warleader in play then using Wild Pyromancer and Equality would not destroy other murlocs on the board, leading to unclear interactions for some players."

Can they just not change this? I honestly find it SUPER stupid how the lords in Hearthstone that give health permanently give it. Like, is it really that hard to make them give -2/-1 when they leave play this way it can kill things? I do find it funny that I just got a Warleader. Guess I'll take 400 free dust.
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#288
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I think the Hex change is fair, I mean Shaman does excel at a lot of stuff. Strong big dudes, strong board flooding little dudes, strong AoE, and still some of the best single target removal in the game.


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#289
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Hex feels random now, but it's a card that should have been nerfed alot sooner than this.


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#290
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The more I've been discussing the FWA change the angrier I'm getting. Fibonacci, pretty much the big name Warrior player in HS (when the update came out a few months ago that counted ranked wins above 500, we learned he had over 22k wins as Control Warrior), made a pretty good point about it: https://twitter.com/...146774993633282

 

It's like the fucking "more than 9 deck slots would be confusing" bullshit. Like, who the fuck doesn't look at the bottom half of their cards and only views the mana costs because they're the easiest to see? And why the hell should balance be done around that kind of person?

 

Saw someone bring up a good point, this seems like the Karazhan patch where they intended to nerf Shaman and instead nerfed all its counters so Shaman became more rampant than ever before.

 

I just can't believe they haven't hit Jade Idol yet, it has the same problem that was the reasoning behind the Quest Rogue nerf but they refuse to hit it.


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#291
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I don't disagree with the Hex and Win Axe nerfs, but why now? These nerfs would of been great like a year ago while we were playing Warriorstone and Shamanstone. All this really does is weaken an already weak class (Shaman) while removing one of Jade Druid's bad match-ups (Pirate Warrior). 

 

I wish they had gone with the refresh crystals idea, or something else, instead of making Innervate a coin. It just feels a bit boring, although I guess its fine since now we don't have to deal with T1 Innervate -> Flappy Bird. Spreading Plague at 6 seems insignificant when you realize that two of the aggro decks you'd used this against also just got nerfed. I'm surprised to see UI not be touched considering the outcry.

 

Warleader nerf is silly to me, at least at this time. It nerfs another one of Jade Druid's bad match-up while also permanently weakening Murloc cards. I also find it interesting that they specify the Pyro Equality interaction with the Warleader, since I feel most of the confusion from health aura buffs are entirely how the coding works in the game.

 

Overall very confusing set of nerfs that feel like they're mistimed, although not entirely unjustified.


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#292
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Speaking of Warleader, I did see a funny joke about that. The reason for the nerf is because so many people beat the Lich King with Murlocs, so he forced Ben Brode to do it. He should still be working there, yeah?


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#293
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The reasoning behind the War Axe nerf was dumb but I do think the fact that they nerfed it is fine. It's been a borderline problematic card for a very long time, and frankly it feels like it had to get hit eventually. It's obviously gonna hurt warriors a lot, but it'll probably be good in the long run.

 

I also disagree with saying the Spreading Plague nerf isn't gonna matter. Increasing the cost by one mana, in conjunction with nerfing Innervate which let you play it faster, means it probably comes down 1-2 turns later than it does now. Against any aggro deck worth its salt, giving them another turn or two to hit you in the face is a big deal. And I do think there will be perfectly viable aggro decks. I doubt Murlocadin will fully die, because while Warleader being hit matters a lot, Murlocs still have very powerful tools. Token Shaman, which can kill pretty fast as well, gets buffed by Spreading Plague being nerfed even with Hex costing more as well. People have taken Face Hunter to legend already, Zoo is a borderline viable deck, and the most powerful counter in the meta to those decks just got nerfed. Plus, Priest is probably going to become stronger now, and both Razakus and Big Priest struggle against aggro, the former because no Reno and lack of consistent early game+healing, the latter because it can't consistently do anything until like turn 6-7. 

 

Also, in the case of Jade Druid, Razakus can already beat it fairly well. And, importantly, the Innervate nerf makes it harder for Druids to get out UI early, which is a very big deal because it gives you more time to get Skulking Geist down. In long control matchups, Geist is a game winner. 

 

So tl;dr I think the War Axe nerf is a good idea but poorly reasoned, and the hits to Jade Druid matter. 


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#294
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I do agree that War Axe's nerf was a long time coming. Weapons in general are very powerful cards because they represent board clearing over multiple turns. Hearthstone is at its core a game about fighting for the board and weapons do this exceptionally well. The issue is Warrior being the best weapon class which is something that is going to be in flux for a little when they nerf the best weapon in the game.
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#295
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They really should've at least done something better for it. The change is lazy and their reasoning is ridiculous. All the other 3 mana 3/2 weapons have an ability going for them, they could've at least given FWA something.


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#296
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They really should've at least done something better for it. The change is lazy and their reasoning is ridiculous. All the other 3 mana 3/2 weapons have an ability going for them, they could've at least given FWA something.


They actually couldn't. War Axe is a basic card. Basic cards should be the most simple version of an effect. Giving it anything would have gone against this.
If anyone is willing to trade me a HA Cranidos, HA Snover, HA Burmy and/or Shaymin in Gen 6 I'd be your best friend forever.

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#297
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gonna stand by Win Axe not being broken

It's definitely not a fair card, but it's not polarizing. It's just strong, and there's nothing wrong with strong cards, especially for a class that has the worst hero power, overall.

Making it +1 mana when King's Defender exists is ridiculous. Win Axe prob deserved a nerf in the past, but not anymore, really.

#298
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This is a really weird statement, but just because the card was run in pretty much every Warrior deck since Hearthstone came out doesn't mean it was broken and needed a nerf. There are plenty of class cards like that. Warrior has the worst Hero Power and is soon going to be the new turn 2 Hero Power + Emote hero.

 

Which reminds me, Priest should get better with these changes. However I'm not really a fan of Razakus Priest and their darn machine gun.


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#299
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So the Arena synergy cards are being removed in the patch after the balance patch. No idea when that'll be, though.


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