Paedophilia a 'sexual orientation - like being straight or gay'

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/paedophilia-sexual-orientation-straight-gay-criminal-psychologist-child-sex-abuse-a6965956.html

 

A paedophile has the 'same ingrained attraction that a heterosexual female may feel towards a male', psychologist says

 

SIGH

[Delibirb]

I mean, that does logic.

 

It's just that acting upon their orientation is, logically, illegal. That's where the problem is.

 

It must be really sucky to be a pedophile with morals, to be fair.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

Oh, like a biological attraction to younger and more fit mates? Sure, the should cover pedos who like 18-13 year olds. Doesn't explain the pedos who prefer younger

[Delibirb]

Oh, like a biological attraction to younger and more fit mates? Sure, the should cover pedos who like 18-13 year olds. Doesn't explain the pedos who prefer younger

There doesn't necessarily have to be any reason for sexual attraction beyond abnormal brain chemistry. There's no evolutionary biological reason for someone to prefer their own sex, as it accomplishes nothing for the species. Yet it occurs. This is the same idea. There's no good reason for someone to be attracted to any particular demographic, it's just the way they're wired, and there shouldn't be any stigma or analysis regarding it.

 

As long as pedophiles remain within the confines of the law, there's no reason their orientation should be regarded as anything more than an irrelevant piece of trivia, like any orientation. It doesn't need to be explained and it doesn't need to be feared, not any more than gay people or, in fact, straight people, need to be feared for potential to rape someone.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

Innate sexual attraction is bullshit. Attraction is forgeable, changeable, and evolves over time much like taste. I'm gay by choice and wasn't born that way. 

 

It's perfectly possible to have sex with someone you don't initially find attractive, have a better time than you thought, and have an increased attraction to that person and people who remind you of them going forward. It's also possible to have sex with someone you initially find attractive and they're a dud, causing you to no longer find that person or people who remind you of them attractive. Then you can reverse your preconceptions again.  

 

If your "brain chemistry" tells you to rape kids then make a concerted effort to alter your brain chemistry or keep it in your pants. Apologizing for "pedophiles with morals" is "really sucky" and so is this article.

[Delibirb]

Innate sexual attraction is bullshit. Attraction is forgeable, changeable, and evolves over time much like taste. I'm gay by choice and wasn't born that way. 

 

It's perfectly possible to have sex with someone you don't initially find attractive, have a better time than you thought, and have an increased attraction to that person and people who remind you of them going forward. It's also possible to have sex with someone you initially find attractive and they're a dud, causing you to no longer find that person or people who remind you of them attractive. Then you can reverse your preconceptions again.  

 

If your "brain chemistry" tells you to f*** kids then make a concerted effort to alter your brain chemistry or keep it in your pants. Apologizing for "pedophiles with morals" is "really sucky" and so is this article.

I didn't say you couldn't change it. I didn't say you couldn't sleep with someone you aren't initially attracted to. I didn't say I was apologizing for anyone. You're making a lot of irrational attacks on my simple logic, and assuming many false intentions of my position, based on your preconceived notion that pedophilia, as a rule, is evil. It's not. Acting upon it is, but what happens in their head is not, inherently.

 

Your statement that if one is attracted to children that they should ignore their impulses is precisely what I am saying. Just as straight, own-age-attracted(?) people with thoughts of rape should ignore their impulses. My comment was merely momentarily empathizing with how depressing that must be for responsible pedophiles, not implying they shouldn't have to do so.

 

To reiterate, I am not have not, and will not defend the act of pedophilia. But the identity is, while disturbing to most (to be fair, just as any other sexuality might be disturbing to any other one), should not inherently be considered evil as long as those who identify as such maintain control.

[Astolfo]

As long as it doesn't transgress into reality, I don't see the problem.

[cr47t]

I honestly see no reason to believe that this (the proposition of pedophilia being an orientation) makes any sense whatsoever.

[Delibirb]

I honestly see no reason to believe that this (the proposition of pedophilia being an orientation) makes any sense whatsoever.

The fact that people are attracted to children would imply it is an orientation, given that's how every other orientation works.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

 

I didn't say x or y or z or omega 

 

The bulk of my post constituted my general thoughts addressing the topic at hand, a line or two incorporated reactions to your post. 

 

I'd sooner empathize with child rape victims than their abusers. Affording too much empathy towards harmful, criminal behaviour enables it. 

[Sunshine Jesse]

Calling something unrelated to gender a sexual orientation is weird to me. It seems more like a fetish.

 

It's certainly better to try to understand pedophiles and attempt to "fix" them instead of immediately decrying them as awful horrible monsters unworthy of even the slightest consideration.

 

It's important to understand that trying to explain the nature behind something is different from trying to sympathize with it.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

It's certainly better to try to understand pedophiles and attempt to "fix" them instead of immediately decrying them as awful horrible monsters unworthy of even the slightest consideration.

 

Unfortunately, the former isn't something a child has the luxury of doing while being raped. There is a global industry for child prostitution and child porn with powerful people involved from Scotland Yard to the Vatican to Washington, DC and too few predators are caught. 

[Delibirb]

 

 

 

 

The bulk of my post constituted my general thoughts addressing the topic at hand, a line or two incorporated reactions to your post. 

 

I'd sooner empathize with child rape victims than their abusers. Affording too much empathy towards harmful, criminal behaviour enables it. 

 

You don't have to empathize the behavior, no one here has implied any such thing. I merely said I feel sympathy for the constant internal struggle of people who don't exhibit the behavior. The behavior is cruel and vile and simply cannot be allowed to exist.

[Astolfo]

Some people can't help but feel that way.

 

Same reason some people are into other things.

 

They can't help it.

 

What they like is considered vile and society considers them as vile for something they can't help.

 

If they can repress the urges to take their fetish into reality, that's admirable of them and I sympathize.

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

It's fundamentally different though. The idea behind LGB rights is that the gov doesn't have the right to tell two consenting adults how they can act in their private life. Since you don't have two consenting adults in this case, I see no reason to equate them in any manner. This is closer to bestiality than it is LGB (if acted upon) 

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

Some people can't help but feel that way.

 

Yes they can. To start, some people can change their avatars and stop masturbating to children or depictions thereof. 

[Astolfo]

It's fundamentally different though. The idea behind LGB rights is that the gov doesn't have the right to tell two consenting adults how they can act in their private life. Since you don't have two consenting adults in this case, I see no reason to equate them in any manner. This is closer to bestiality than it is LGB (if acted upon) 

But most don't.

 

 

Yes they can. To start, some people can change their avatars and stop masturbating to children or depictions thereof. 

That only stops the getting-off to said urges.

It doesn't get rid of the urges.

Only extensive therapy does that.

[VCR_CAT]

I mean, a lot of this article just sounds like you can get the same result treating the attraction like a mental illness...

[Medivh]

Children aren't a gender. LGB attraction is based exclusively on gender. 

 

People who act on paedophilic urges, inherent or not, deserve to die. People who attempt to make it seem like their own attraction to children is justifiable are slime and should be put on some kind of government watchlist. 

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

That only stops the getting-off to said urges.

It doesn't get rid of the urges.

Only extensive therapy does that.

 

There's only so much therapy to go around and the indulgence of urges creates a need for more therapy.

 

To those who reinforce a narrative that it's okay, those who don't take accountability for their habits, those who spring to the advocacy of pedophiles while saying nothing on behalf of the children - I implore those people to change and change however they can. If it's through extensive therapy and whatever that entails, for them to seek it. If it's through distraction and finding new urges, through meditation and soul-searching, through prayer, through any combination thereof - to employ whatever methods are at their disposal to acknowledge this bleak reality for what it is: rape, torture, and damage.

 

Pedophilia must be stigmatized and it must be crushed wherever it exists. Those who tolerate it in themselves or others have no place calling themselves rational. 

[a bad post]

This debate has been going on for years, nothing new. This isn't even proven science, just a theory that psychologists (especially criminal psychologists) have been tossing around for years to explain the actions of pedophiles. Bet if you put something like this into Google or whatever you'd find search results going back at least a decade if not more.  

 

There's only so much therapy to go around and the indulgence of urges creates a need for more therapy.

 

To those who reinforce a narrative that it's okay, those who don't take accountability for their habits, those who spring to the advocacy of pedophiles while saying nothing on behalf of the children - I implore those people to change and change however they can. If it's through extensive therapy and whatever that entails, for them to seek it. If it's through distraction and finding new urges, through meditation and soul-searching, through prayer, through any combination thereof - to employ whatever methods are at their disposal to acknowledge this bleak reality for what it is: rape, torture, and damage.

 

Pedophilia must be stigmatized and it must be crushed wherever it exists. Those who tolerate it in themselves or others have no place calling themselves rational. 

Can you maybe chill? Nobody here is saying that the actions of pedophiles aren't deplorable, they're just suggesting courses of action that are beyond "these people have something wrong with them, the solution must be to stigmatize them and make them societal outcasts". That sort of argument is exactly how you generate sympathy for a group of people. 

 

I mean, a lot of this article just sounds like you can get the same result treating the attraction like a mental illness...

This is basically the article right here.

 

It's much better, and also lends a more moral high ground to your position, if you choose to extend a helping hand to help someone change their behavior rather than turn them away cause you think what they're doing is wrong (that being said there's no debate whether or not what pedophiles are doing is wrong). Just take a step back and see what Neph and Heinous are trying to say. They're not saying that this justifies the behavior of pedophiles, they're saying that it is better to try to provide avenues for people like this to change themselves than tell people to just don't do it. What you're trying to argue greatly over simplifies the argument, because sexual attraction may be fluid, but it's not as easy as just saying I want to be this or that.

 

 

Children aren't a gender. LGB attraction is based exclusively on gender. 

 

People who act on paedophilic urges, inherent or not, deserve to die. People who attempt to make it seem like their own attraction to children is justifiable are slime and should be put on some kind of government watchlist. 

It's called the sex offender registry my dude

 

 

It's fundamentally different though. The idea behind LGB rights is that the gov doesn't have the right to tell two consenting adults how they can act in their private life. Since you don't have two consenting adults in this case, I see no reason to equate them in any manner. This is closer to bestiality than it is LGB (if acted upon) 

This is the only problem I have with articles like these. Every time I see something like this it's always used either a) by pedophiles to lump themselves in with LGBT community and try to justify their behavior or b) used by bigots to justify their homophobia.

[Medivh]

I assumed the sex offender registry was only for people who had committed sexual offenses. 

[Ryusei the Morning Star]

This is the only problem I have with articles like these. Every time I see something like this it's always used either a) by pedophiles to lump themselves in with LGBT community and try to justify their behavior or b) used by bigots to justify their homophobia.

Just to be clear, are you accusing me of this?

 

To clarify, I think that LGB (marriage equality) gives Incest a legal outlet to be legalized, but I think I've made pretty clear how the logic used to justify LGB would not work for pedophilia or bestiality 

[a bad post]

Just to be clear, are you accusing me of this?

 

To clarify, I think that LGB (marriage equality) gives Incest a legal outlet to be legalized, but I think I've made pretty clear how the logic used to justify LGB would not work for pedophilia or bestiality 

no no no, you just seemed to bringing up the problem so i quoted you, i was more agreeing with you than anything else

 

I assumed the sex offender registry was only for people who had committed sexual offenses. 

pedophilia is a sexual offense

[(GigaDrillBreaker)]

Just saying, Polaris, just because your own orientation is by choice doesn't mean that is the case for everyone. If it were, gay rights wouldn't have been as big a deal as they were.