Invoked Ginnungagap - Aleister/Caliga advanced form

[Darj]

Invoked Ginnungagap
Attibute: DARK
Type: Wyrm/Fusion/Effect
Level: 11
ATK: 2900
DEF: 3700
1 "Invoked" monster + 1 DARK monster
Must first be Fusion Summoned with the above Fusion Materials. Once per turn, during either player's turn, when a Spell/Trap Card, or monster effect, is activated: You can target 1 card you control or in your Graveyard with the same card type (Monster, Spell, or Trap) as that card; banish it, and if you do, cards, or the effects of cards, of that type cannot be activated for the rest of this turn. If this card is in your Graveyard: You can target 1 "Aleister the Invoker" or "Invocation" in your Graveyard; shuffle this card into the Deck, and if you do, add that card to your hand. You can only use this effect of "Invoked Ginnungagap" once per turn.

 

 

Impact-wise, it is intended to support the Invoked archetype by being able to use Aleister itself as the DARK material plus any Invoked Fusion to drop a bigger threat. This should come in handy when Aleister is discarded for its ATK boost effect, its search is negated, or otherwise ends in the grave, so it can be banished by the Invokation Spell and then be grabbed back by the same Spell card. Also it offers a direction to the archetype towards the DARK attribute, encouraging the use of DARK techs, engines, archetypes, etc. Besides, due to Aleister's Attribute of DARK, the Invoked archetype inherently leans towards this Attribute.

 

Flavor-wise:

- This is an advanced, and possibly final stage of Aleister's transformation, as implied by Invoked Caliga, and it's supposed to rival the ultimate Summon, Elysium, in power level; hence the requirement of an "Invoked" Fusion monster.

- It's Level 11 and Wyrm to not overlap with the Level and Attribute of any of the other Invokeds, and from the Wyrm typing it could be said it's based on Diabolos or Bahamut from the Final Fantasy series.

- It has +2100 ATK/DEF than Aleister/Caliga. The extra +100 is to not overlap with Magellanica's 3000 ATK. By the way, this made me realize Elysium has +2200 ATK/DEF than Aleister.

- Following the naming of Cocytus, Purgatrio and Elysion, this monster is named after a location from literature or mythology. In its case, Ginnungagap, a place in Nordic mythology that is described as a void.

- The lock effect is to stay in theme with Caliga's floodgate effects.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

Update log:

5/1/17:

Slightly lowered the stats, made the lock effect more forgiving, and added an effect intended to "rescue" your Aleister core/engine by giving you back an Aleister or Invokation stuck in the grave by being negated, discarded, etc., while getting itself back into the Extra Deck PSY-Framelord style for self-sustainability.

[Darj]

Bringing the thread up because I'm really looking forward for opinions and reviews on this one.

[VCR_CAT]

So, it's intended to be the "final evolution", even though it's objectively better and easier to summer than what is supposed to be the main boss of the deck. Not only that, its main effect is essentially taking Shock Master and going "Yeah, just slap it on a bigger body what could possibly go wrong?" The balance is honestly just ludicrous; Elysium's conditions means that you need to actually control a monster special summoned from the Extra Deck; this monster you can just slap out on the field if you've ever summoned an Invoked monster at all, it's pants-on-head retarded how easy this is going to be to get out. I can't honestly say the flavor is even that great either. Invoked monsters aren't Aliester combining with them; they're summons, their artworks all depict Aliester's staff sticking out of a part of their body as a way to symbolize that they're being controlled in some way. Also, why DARK? There's already a DARK Invoked.

 

So no, if you want a review/opinion, it's that these needs to get brought back to the drawing board. It honestly doesn't even do anything new or different, or really play with the archetype's mechanics, it's just "Here's a stupidly powerful effect slapped onto an easy-to-summon monster." What niche is this trying to fill? More importantly, why is it so dang easy to summon? If you're going to make a "final boss" for Invoked (as if they don't already have one), you need to put more time into setting it apart, and actually making it harder to summon than the monster that's supposed to be one evo lower than it.

[Darj]

So, it's intended to be the "final evolution", even though it's objectively better and easier to summer than what is supposed to be the main boss of the deck. Not only that, its main effect is essentially taking Shock Master and going "Yeah, just slap it on a bigger body what could possibly go wrong?" The balance is honestly just ludicrous; Elysium's conditions means that you need to actually control a monster special summoned from the Extra Deck; this monster you can just slap out on the field if you've ever summoned an Invoked monster at all, it's pants-on-head retarded how easy this is going to be to get out. I can't honestly say the flavor is even that great either. Invoked monsters aren't Aliester combining with them; they're summons, their artworks all depict Aliester's staff sticking out of a part of their body as a way to symbolize that they're being controlled in some way. Also, why DARK? There's already a DARK Invoked.

 

So no, if you want a review/opinion, it's that these needs to get brought back to the drawing board. It honestly doesn't even do anything new or different, or really play with the archetype's mechanics, it's just "Here's a stupidly powerful effect slapped onto an easy-to-summon monster." What niche is this trying to fill? More importantly, why is it so dang easy to summon? If you're going to make a "final boss" for Invoked (as if they don't already have one), you need to put more time into setting it apart, and actually making it harder to summon than the monster that's supposed to be one evo lower than it.

 

As mentioned in the OP, the DARK Invoked is different to the rest because it appears to actually be a corrupted Aleister, rather than a completely different entity, so I want to develop on that DARK side/branch of Invokeds.

The niche again is to give Invokeds a self-sustainable way to banish a Aleister stuck in the grave, as well as to allow for the building of a dedicated Invoked deck with DARK techs, instead of only as an engine as it is currently played. Also, Elysium, the "supposed main boss", is more of an emergency button, and one that players aren't actually running because of its situational nature. So, this card is intended to offer Invokeds a boss they can access more consistently; a proper boss that offers them structure as an archetype, rather than an engine, basically.

The effect is strong yeah, but also made it as vulnerable as possible: it can be disrupted by Crow, Lancea, etc., must be used preemptively like Dweller. I know very well the "not because it can be countered means it's fair" fallacy, but still... really wanted to push for an strong effect for a change, and one that integrates the concepts of both Caliga and Mechaba.

To clear up, the card is not intended to be a "final boss" for Invokeds and the archetype as a whole, but an evolved/final form of Aleister, hence why I don't want to take the "final boss --> convoluted summoning condition" approach, which, exactly as you mentioned, is already covered by Elysium. Its Level 11 is just to not overlap with any of the current Levels really, but it's not actually intended to surpass Elysium as a boss monster flavor-wise; mechanic-wise it does, though, due to being more accessible than Elysium. Also, IMO it doesn't really need to do anything new or different either; Invokeds stand out for their relatively simple effects: Raidjin is a Book of Moon, Mechaba is Arcana Knight Joker, and so on. Besides, it already assists the Aleister engine/core by getting Aleister banished so Invokation can grab it back, something that Elysium's materials won't allow.

And it's not easier to Summon than Caliga when it requires an "Invoked" monster :v but yeah, I won't play fool here: getting an Invoked in either field or grave is just as easy for them. However, it is intended to be easier to Summon than Elysium, after all.

 

Admittedly, I pushed the power on this one, and that's the reason I was looking for a review/opinion. I knew something was off, but can't pinpoint where or how. And I don't want to just nerf if so much that it ends up just as playable as Elysium, which isn't played, so... yeah. And being told to take this card back to the drawing board doesn't help.

 

 

I guess I can start by cutting down the stats. 2000/2800 or 2800/2000, inverted, should remain flavorful without being too overwhelming. And would make sense with the "not actually stronger than Elysium" approach, in fact, plus it would justify its relatively easy fusion material requirements. Another option is of course weakening the effect. I have yet to find the "sweet spot" between stats, effect and practicality, and that's what I was hoping to get suggestions or ideas for.

[Darj]

Update!

Slightly lowered the stats, made the lock effect more forgiving, and added an effect intended to "rescue" your Aleister core/engine by giving you back an Aleister or Invokation stuck in the grave by being negated, discarded, etc., while getting itself back into the Extra Deck PSY-Framelord style for self-sustainability.

[Darj]

Bringing this up because I want to be sure it's fine now. And no, scraping it isn't an option; would rather make it work as the boss that Elysium could have been.