OCG Banlist October 2017

[VCR_CAT]

Newly Forbidden:

Master Peace, the True Dracoslaying King

Dragonic Diagram

 

Newly Limited:

Tribe-Infecting Virus

Aleister the Invoker

Dinomight Knight, the True Dracofighter

Souleating Oviraptor

Babycerasaurus

ABC-Dragon Buster

Denglong, First of the Yang Zing

Terraforming

Spellbook of Secrets

True Draco Heritage

True King’s Return

Trickstar Reincarnation

 

Newly Semi-Limited:

Summoner Monk

Windwitch – Ice Bell

Maxx “C”

Pot of Avarice

Future Fusion

Fossil Dig

 

Newly Unlimited:

Performapal Pendulum Sorcerer

Witch of the Black Forest

Scarm, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss

Rescue Cat

Burial from a Different Dimension

Fire Formation – Tenki

Preparation of Rites

Saqlifice

Domain of the True Monarchs

Wavering Eyes

Dragon Ravine

 

 

 

Sauce: https://ygorganization.com/ocg-october-1st-forbiddenlimited-list/

Alright kiddies, time to stop playing Arc V cards VRAINS is in town.

[Dragulas]

Reactions: 

 

Newly Forbidden:

Master Peace, the True Dracoslaying King - Had it comming, nothing to add great news

Dragonic Diagram - I may not agree with this one, with all other hits having it at 1 (over there) should ve been fine

 

Newly Limited:

Tribe-Infecting Virus - About damn time

Aleister the Invoker - I would ve started with semi first, but all you need is 1 to start the plays so is understandable

Dinomight Knight, the True Dracofighter - Not gonna miss it at all

Souleating Oviraptor - I said it when it was first revealed (or at least i thought about the topic) this is a searcher for a type not an archtype, regardless of how little dinos are supported this does too much, but again i would started with semi first

Babycerasaurus - not once per turn and able summon itself, didnt think they would hit this though

ABC-Dragon Buster - FINALLY!!! i gues players will think twice to tag out just because they want

Denglong, First of the Yang Zing - This hurts puer YZ more than dino hybrid, they only need 1 most of the time, but its too good of a card to stay at 3, again understandable

Terraforming - had it coming, probably banned in future

Spellbook of Secrets - If that little engine was becoming something it was anoying, if they dont like it shouls ve hit knowledge directly

True Draco Heritage - expected

True King’s Return - Never though they would hit both i must say

Trickstar Reincarnation - When are you going to learn to put hard OPT on your cards Konami (that may not be the main reason of the hit but still)

 

Newly Semi-Limited:

Summoner Monk  - Forgot they had it at 1, about time

Windwitch – Ice Bell - Interesting hit, indestructible CW is very dificult to handle for some decks

Maxx “C” - wonder if it will follow TCG Route, also with dracos "out of the map" 95% of relevant decks special summons so there is that.

Pot of Avarice - With Zoo out of the map should be fine, on side note Why cant we have this back too

Future Fusion - No longer a sack card (after errata) it sould go to 3 eventually

Fossil Dig - Rota is at 1, i don think it needs much explenation

 

Newly Unlimited:

Performapal Pendulum Sorcerer - Pendulums got it  back in TCG and did nothing, expected

Witch of the Black Forest - Almost no sense to search a powerfull monster if i cant use it till nex turn

Scarm, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss -  BA is dead until they get their Link, with dante and TGU still at 1 this doesnt matter

Rescue Cat - same as future fusion

Burial from a Different Dimension - And we still have it at 1 for some reason

Fire Formation – Tenki - This sould be at 2 (no more no less), its just a matter of time before another Beast warrior archtype arrives to the game and put it back on the list

Preparation of Rites - Sure, Pre prep is better anyways (IK not all decks can use it)

Saqlifice - Personal and burning hate for Qli doesnt allow me to aprove this

Domain of the True Monarchs - They still have most of their toys compared to TCG, interesting, as long as Pantheism stays at 1 no problem

Wavering Eyes - Pends are not and wont be relevant (who knos when)

Dragon Ravin - a little late

[EHN.]

I get they want to push links but Aleister and motherf***ing Secrets to 1? Are you f***ing shitting me? 

 

If they hated the draw engine being splashed that's their own f***ing fault, no need to butcher a deck that hasn't seen any competitive play since 2013.

 

WW Invoked died with MR4 and pure Invoked or Luna WW were just about considered rogue in the Draco meta. They murdered Draco so why go after the little engine cards that could just about compete on their own? Typical Konami bullshittery. 

 

Let the SPYRALs commence I guess. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

[The Highlander]

So they even used salt to make absolutely sure True Draco is obliterated ... I do not know ... I liked Master Peace as a generic card, it made Weatheries less awful ...

Dinosaurs lose their main playmakers (excluding miscella ... which means dino yang zing is sadly not completely destroyed).

ABC was about time.

Preparations ... time for other nekroz cards to be unlimited ... which they would not do.

[Darj]

Wow, no mercy for True Dracos, even Dinomight got a hit. I too liked Master Peace as a teachable boss in mainly Continuous Spell/Trap decks, oh well.

 

Admittedly I was annoyed at the hits on Aleister and Book of Secrets. I mean, with True Dracos out of the picture and Dinos hit, they would have have a chance to shine (more), possibly as standalone deck rather than an engine, and yet they got hits too; I really wanted to see them dominate at least for 1 format. Granted, that may still have some presence after the hits.

 

Dinos usually ran just 1 Denglong, right? Limiting it only hurts Yang Zings more, as Dragulas pointed out already. The consistency hits make sense, though.

 

Even Trickstars got banlist attention with a hit on Reincarnation, huh. I find that a bit funny. They would, or should, have hit Lycoris if they wanted to really get rid of their massive burn tactics.

 

I see toys for Qliphorts, Pals and Nekroz starting to be unbanned. Would be amusing if they got careless with the unbans and out of the sudden they took the lead again unintentionally xD

 

 

WW Invoked died with MR4 and pure Invoked or Luna WW were just about considered rogue in the Draco meta. They murdered Draco so why go after the little engine cards that could just about compete on their own? Typical Konami bullshittery.

 

What does MR4 means, by the way? I don't recall the acronym.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

For any of you guys who haven't played OCG recently and haven't seen what SPYRALs have been doing there, they're going to make you miss True Draco Zoo. They tend to go +8 to +12 on their first turn and they'll generally have unbreakable set-ups involving Tri-gate Wizard/Naturia Beast/traps/hand traps. They can also FTK with Cannon Soldier. The next OCG format isn't going to be fun, you'll need at least 6 hand traps in every deck to even think about playing Yugioh.

 

I really hope they're at least glanced at in the next TCG list, whether it's a limit to Quick-Fix or a hit on Machine Dupe (which, whenever it's relevant is a problem).

 

If it weren't for SPYRALs this could've been a really fun format, too. I'm very happy with pretty much every change that was made, it's just more changes will be necessary. Perhaps an emergency banlist, SPYRALs right now are worse than PePe in its prime and Quick-Fix getting detached by rank 1's to circumvent its drawback of getting banished when it leaves the field isn't fair play and feels very much like a loophole Konami missed. 

[Darj]

Woah, SPYRALs are in OCG already? The last metagme reports I saw didn't made any mention of them; I'm looking at the latest ones right now.

And did Konami really overlook Quik Fix, I wonder. I mean, for example, they are familiar with Hard OPTs by now and could very well have given Quik Fix the clause from the beginning, and yet they didn't. Similar to Dragonic Diagram having a regular OPT when they gave hard OPTs to other Field Spells, as if they intended for it to have a major impact.

[VampireofDarkness]

Woah, SPYRALs are in OCG already? The last metagme reports I saw didn't made any mention of them; I'm looking at the latest ones right now.

And did Konami really overlook Quik Fix, I wonder. I mean, for example, they are familiar with Hard OPTs by now and could very well have given Quik Fix the clause from the beginning, and yet they didn't. Similar to Dragonic Diagram having a regular OPT when they gave hard OPTs to other Field Spells, as if they intended for it to have a major impact.

Results for first SPYRAL came out just the other day.

 

And while this initially was shocking to me, I kinda realized something: This is basically the listed that pushed Kozmo to the top all over again. True Draco's hits are on the same level of bsery that Shaddolls got when it got to their time, Invoked is basically the Ritual Beast hits all over again, Dinos are Qli, and ABC is BA. The amount of smug I want to give Konami for not only repeating one of the worst banlists in recent times but going way too hard JUST to push Links is something I cannot give enough of. Hopefully the next set of packs give actually playable Decks. In the meantime, haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaave fun kids!

[EHN.]

Results for first SPYRAL came out just the other day.

 

And while this initially was shocking to me, I kinda realized something: This is basically the listed that pushed Kozmo to the top all over again. 

 

That wasn't even the first time and this probably won't be the last time either.

 

 

What does MR4 means, by the way? I don't recall the acronym.

 

Master Rule 4. The strongest opening the deck has ever seen was Crystal Wing + Raidjin which needed 2 extra monsters. It's just a really silly time to go after the deck.

[Darj]

Master Rule 4. The strongest opening the deck has ever seen was Crystal Wing + Raidjin which needed 2 extra monsters. It's just a really silly time to go after the deck.

 

Ah, thanks.

Yeah, Invokeds didn't really get their big time to shine because MR4/"Link Rules" were issued shortly after.

[VampireofDarkness]

That wasn't even the first time and this probably won't be the last time either.

You're not wrong, unfortunately. It just feels like there has to be a better way to handle it. Like releasing consistently good cards

 

 

For any of you guys who haven't played OCG recently and haven't seen what SPYRALs have been doing there, they're going to make you miss True Draco Zoo. They tend to go +8 to +12 on their first turn and they'll generally have unbreakable set-ups involving Tri-gate Wizard/Naturia Beast/traps/hand traps. They can also FTK with Cannon Soldier. The next OCG format isn't going to be fun, you'll need at least 6 hand traps in every deck to even think about playing Yugioh.

 

I really hope they're at least glanced at in the next TCG list, whether it's a limit to Quick-Fix or a hit on Machine Dupe (which, whenever it's relevant is a problem).

 

If it weren't for SPYRALs this could've been a really fun format, too. I'm very happy with pretty much every change that was made, it's just more changes will be necessary. Perhaps an emergency banlist, SPYRALs right now are worse than PePe in its prime and Quick-Fix getting detached by rank 1's to circumvent its drawback of getting banished when it leaves the field isn't fair play and feels very much like a loophole Konami missed. 

Forgot to address this. Don't overhype SPYRALs. The big issue IMO is that for as ridiculous as their boards can be, they don't have as many follow up plays when their cards get negated in comparison to Dinos, Zoo, and True Draco. The most SPYRAL need I think is just a Semi Limit of Quik-Fix. No more Machine Dupe done right for ya. To claim they will make you miss True Draco Zoo is laughable, and only encourages poor mindsets I would more expect out of someone else on this same thread. SPYRAL are only THIS good rn because every other Deck got hit, no other reason.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

Forgot to address this. Don't overhype SPYRALs. The big issue IMO is that for as ridiculous as their boards can be, they don't have as many follow up plays when their cards get negated in comparison to Dinos, Zoo, and True Draco. The most SPYRAL need I think is just a Semi Limit of Quik-Fix. No more Machine Dupe done right for ya. To claim they will make you miss True Draco Zoo is laughable, and only encourages poor mindsets I would more expect out of someone else on this same thread. SPYRAL are only THIS good rn because every other Deck got hit, no other reason.

 

Wrong.

 

This list hasn't taken effect yet. This is what SPYRALs look like before every other deck gets hit: http://roadoftheking.com/ocg-2017-07-metagame-report-11 

 

"True Draco has disappeared from the top." already, because of SPYRALs. I'm happy to see Diagram and Heritage hit as they were, but to hit them while completely ignoring something that is so much worse is cynical (and a pattern with Konami that you'd alluded to earlier). Dinosaurs were already in the process of being phased out with more players transitioning to SPYRALs as results of the paradigm shift became evident. If Dinos weren't hit at all, they'd still only lose ground to SPYRALs in ensuing tournaments for the foreseeable future. The writing was on the wall for Dinos with Diagram at 1, Oviraptor at 3, Babycerasaurus at 3, Denglong at 3, and Fossil Dig at 3. Now those cards have all been hit and SPYRALs weren't touched. What was an uphill battle for Dinosaurs becomes extinction when this list takes effect. 

 

Everything is lining up for the first couple weeks of October in the OCG to be an absolute massacre. 66% is the threshold for Tier 0, and nothing will be in SPYRALs' way of getting there.

[Dragulas]

SPYRALS will be (or should i say is) the new problem OCG has to adress; when they came to TCG, the first time i saw Quick fix i smell the potential (bullcrap), summonig quick fix adding a card, use machine duplication to summon and keep adding is arguably 1 of their most stupid designs no to mention their revival effect also with the lack of a hard OPT just make it worse. Spyral cards have somewhat an unfair design, while their effects are not that broken by themselves (even bad for some of them) the lack of clauses make them very abusable.

 

Because of cards like quick fix or resort, TCG Konami should be very carefull when they want an exclusive tcg deck to be good, not aall cards need a hard OPT to be balanced, but not adding that to a card just for promoting a deck is something i hate from their part.

[VampireofDarkness]

Wrong.

 

This list hasn't taken effect yet. This is what SPYRALs look like before every other deck gets hit: http://roadoftheking.com/ocg-2017-07-metagame-report-11 

 

"True Draco has disappeared from the top." already, because of SPYRALs. I'm happy to see Diagram and Heritage hit as they were, but to hit them while completely ignoring something that is so much worse is cynical (and a pattern with Konami that you'd alluded to earlier). Dinosaurs were already in the process of being phased out with more players transitioning to SPYRALs as results of the paradigm shift became evident. If Dinos weren't hit at all, they'd still only lose ground to SPYRALs in ensuing tournaments for the foreseeable future. The writing was on the wall for Dinos with Diagram at 1, Oviraptor at 3, Babycerasaurus at 3, Denglong at 3, and Fossil Dig at 3. Now those cards have all been hit and SPYRALs weren't touched. What was an uphill battle for Dinosaurs becomes extinction when this list takes effect. 

 

Everything is lining up for the first couple weeks of October in the OCG to be an absolute massacre. 66% is the threshold for Tier 0, and nothing will be in SPYRALs' way of getting there.

I would argue that SPYRALs would need some more time before their position was established. The OCG have this tendency to get tired of a Deck after playing it for a while and then suddenly drop those Decks to go to either newer ones or old favorites. I could have told you this was coming the moment HEROs got any sort of notable percentage. Using 1 week to predict a format is like using the first week sales of an album to predict the lifespan and overall sales of an album. Sure, this will be skewed now because some areas will already play with the new list in mind, but I don't think it's fair to put them on the same level as Zoo, let alone saying they will make us miss such a Deck. At best, it's an oversight that again is easy to compare to Kozmo. At worst, it will encourage similar panic among the community, and mind you aside from your opinions on where SPYRAL stand I agree with your overall points on the list itself and even 90% of what you said right here. It's definitely going to be a hell of a ride, but I don't think we need to go this far out, and I think we as a community need to tone down the urge to hit the panic button.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

You're right that I can't speak for others, but personally I'd rather play against the TCG's current iteration of True Draco Zoo (with Diagram, Master Peace, Drident, Broadbull, and Barrage unlimited) than the OCG's SPYRALs, and find I stand more of a chance and have more fun with decks that aren't top tier against the former than the latter. I think pitting the two decks against each other would make for an interesting experiment actually. 

 

I'm very happy True Draco Zoo has been dealt with to the extent it has in the OCG but believe in earnest that SPYRALs are even worse since the release of Double Helix. That said, I don't think Double Helix should be the one that gets hit because Links are the future and SPYRALs deserve the chance to compete in the Link era (but not to be the only deck competing). I feel that Quick-Fix is an actually broken card from a design standpoint because of the loophole of not technically being on the field when it's an Xyz Material. It wasn't meant to be re-used multiple times at all (leaves the field is a pretty broad category for its drawback), but it can when used as an Xyz Material in an archetype that has nothing to do with Xyz.

[Dragulas]

It wasn't meant to be re-used multiple times at all (leaves the field is a pretty broad category for its drawback), but it can when used as an Xyz Material in an archetype that has nothing to do with Xyz.

Im pretty sure this and all the poor design aspects of Quick fix were made on purpose. To be fair, most archetypes have nothing to do with Xyz either outside of the present synergy with their levels. But i agree quick fix and mayver resort will become eventually a problem due to the lack hard OPT

[notcleverusername]

For any of you guys who haven't played OCG recently and haven't seen what SPYRALs have been doing there, they're going to make you miss True Draco Zoo. They tend to go +8 to +12 on their first turn and they'll generally have unbreakable set-ups involving Tri-gate Wizard/Naturia Beast/traps/hand traps. They can also FTK with Cannon Soldier. The next OCG format isn't going to be fun, you'll need at least 6 hand traps in every deck to even think about playing Yugioh.

 

I really hope they're at least glanced at in the next TCG list, whether it's a limit to Quick-Fix or a hit on Machine Dupe (which, whenever it's relevant is a problem).

 

If it weren't for SPYRALs this could've been a really fun format, too. I'm very happy with pretty much every change that was made, it's just more changes will be necessary. Perhaps an emergency banlist, SPYRALs right now are worse than PePe in its prime and Quick-Fix getting detached by rank 1's to circumvent its drawback of getting banished when it leaves the field isn't fair play and feels very much like a loophole Konami missed. 

Have you ever considered that sometimes, when a card is borken, it's not because Kinamo missed it but because they want it to be

Have you also considered that if they let Zoodiac play out for full format(s) that they don't usually plan on emergency hitting their Obviously Best Decks

And have you finally considered that a diverse format where there are no Obvious Best Decks is not and probably hasn't recently been any sort of design goal for Nimako

 

Also can you not lose your head over a deck in its first week of play

Like it's pretty obvious Spyral gonna be the best deck moving forward by sheer fact that basically the only other cohesive deck that still actually exists is Magisketeer (and if you're really optimistic, Counter Fairies) but you could at least wait a couple weeks or so before freaking out

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

Have you ever considered that sometimes, when a card is borken, it's not because Kinamo missed it but because they want it to be

Have you also considered that if they let Zoodiac play out for full format(s) that they don't usually plan on emergency hitting their Obviously Best Decks

And have you finally considered that a diverse format where there are Obvious Best Decks is not and probably hasn't recently been any sort of design goal for Nimako

 

Also can you not lose your head over a deck in its first week of play

Like it's pretty obvious Spyral gonna be the best deck moving forward by sheer fact that basically the only other cohesive deck that still actually exists is Magisketeer (and if you're really optimistic, Counter Fairies) but you could at least wait a couple weeks or so before freaking out

 

Given Zoos' dominance and staying power and that we do have some sort of investment in the game, when would've been a more apt and prescient time to have freaked out about them than in their first week when they were known only as Juunishishi? I don't know what parts ignorance and what parts malice went into hitting everything except SPYRALs after they'd already outplussed and overthrown everything that was hit, I can only speculate that it took some combination of both. 

 

Magibullets haven't done much of anything in the OCG of late. If anything Magicians are the next best untouched deck and were helped out some by Wavering Eyes and Pend Sorcerer being bumped. 

[Blake]

they're never going to hit something with product cycle

 

Spyrals are brand new

 

It's not malicious to not hit them. It's common business sense.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

^Malice by another name, and it's the tournaments that get maligned. 

 

https://ygorganization.com/ocg-09182017-ocg-japan-china-decklists/

 

What a bore.  

[notcleverusername]

^Malice by another name, and it's the tournaments that get maligned. 

 

https://ygorganization.com/ocg-09182017-ocg-japan-china-decklists/

 

What a bore.  

What part of "Monkai doesn't give a sheet about your ideal game" isn't getting through

The existence of Zoo for 6+ months in both formats should've already shown you how they feel on 1-2 deck formats

They don't hit """"""degeneracy"""""" unless 1. It's degeneracy they didn't plan for, and even then they usually only hit this after it gets some rando top, or 2. It's out of the business cycle

 

Spyrals ARE the business cycle right now. Every other product out right now is either way past the business cycle, or about as competitive as Igknights were in their prime.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

What even is your angle? Do you care about the game at all or just Konami's quarterly profits?

 

Not that I think pumping out one inane Tier 0 format after another is a particularly effective business model.  

[notcleverusername]

What even is your angle? Do you care about the game at all or just Konami's quarterly profits?

 

Not that I think pumping out one inane Tier 0 format after another is a particularly effective business model.  

I don't care about Kinamo's profits, but I also don't care for complaining about a deck that's probably going to be everywhere for ~3-6 months

I enjoy the game, to the extent that I can read effects and theory-oh dumb and usually impractical combos given that I haven't actually played the game in quite a while now

I don't understand the point in being both a casual player and being super-invested in what the meta is or isn't

The only times we've had "diverse formats" since like Zexal era has been when a banlist has occurred before next notable product, so just enjoy the """""diverse format"""""" we have now

And then play vs friends after that, I guess, since you will apparently hate a solid 3/4+ of the random duels you'll get

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

In retrospect, maybe I got a little overzealous.

 

 

 

OR MAYBE I WAS funking RIGHT

 

THIS sheet IS WORSE THAN ZOO AND MUST DIE

[notcleverusername]

 

I mean, Zoo at least had actual competition ROR

There's literally zero other worthwhile decks in the OCG due to a combination of the banlist and generally poor products. Like, this is the most predictable result.

TCG didn't totally kill off its remaining decks like the OCG did, but they're probably weakened enough that they won't put up much of a fight either.