TCG Banlist Effective November 6th 2017

[VCR_CAT]

Okay, I'm seeing this a lot as people's main reaction to the list. There are a bunch of cards that people can replace their Gofus with.

 

Scapegoat is not as terrible as people think. Cyber Dragon doubles as both Link material and Chimeratech Megafleet Dragon (which, if you scrap an opposing Decode Talker and get a Megafleet is worth more than a Gofu). Instant Fusion is a versatile free Special Summon that can be anything from Thousand-Eyes Restrict for Linkuriboh to Karbonola Warrior for Rank 4's/Nat Beast to Panzer Dragon for Cyber Dragon Infinity to Sea Monster of Theseus for a Tuner. Grinder Golem with Akashic Magician is already an option, and is more or less balanced pre-Security Dragon. Eater of Millions is a free Special Summon and Linkuriboh fodder. Gofu was obviously better than all of these, people could play them regardless of their deck, it was easy, it could be a Decode Talker to protect both frontrow and backrow, it could be a Ningirsu for non-targeting non-destroying spot removal that could be laddered from there, it was Allure fodder, it was 3 monsters for the price of what, it was a Tuner, it still let you Normal Summon for any Link-4 and beyond shenanigans you might have and... it's still at 1. I think it's time people started branching out, I think the hit was pretty predictable with it being at 1 in the OCG, and I don't think it being at 3 was particularly swell for the game and it certainly won't be once the aforementioned Needlefiber and Skulldeat are at large. 

 

None of these are replacements are Gofu, like at all. Gofu's strength was the tokens, not just the free summon, and if I wanted an extra summon spell I'd run, like, frickin' One-Time Security Pass because that at least gives me something that's Cyberse-Type.

 

People need to stop it with the Scapegoat meme, because yes, it is as terrible as we say it is. That's not doing jack-squat on turn 1, it's a set card that I have to wait to use. If your deck isn't playing to a point where it's outputting its end-game or near-end-game fields almost immediately, then frankly it's probably not that great. You're not going to do well if you have to wait an entire turn to actually get your plays going, and people need to stop buying into such an awful meme.

 

Golem isn't as splashable as Gofu was, almost entirely because it eats the Normal Summon. There's still quite a few decks that rely on their Normal Summon to function, and many of them actually find themselves netting more value for using their NS rather than forgoing it.

 

Cyber Dragon isn't a Gofu. It's not plussing, it's not a one-card Link, it's a free summon. That's all it is.

 

Same goes for Instant Fusion, for Eater of Millions, for... pretty much everything you're mentioning. You're not suggesting Gofus, you're not suggesting one-card links, you're not suggesting set-up starter cards that spring combos into life. If this were back when Burning Abyss were more relevant, you'd be suggesting Crane Crane as a replacement for Tour Guide. It's not doing the same thing, it's not serving the same purpose.

 

I get that you're suggesting "Free Summons" to replace Gofu with, but the fact that you're suggesting the cards that you're suggesting tells me that you weren't/aren't aware of why Gofu was as good as it was, and especially in the case of the fact that you think frickin' Scapegoat is good at all.

 

 

As for the best deck right now, Trickstars are looking pretty scary. They were the second best deck in SPYRAL format, some of which can be attributed to the fact that they naturally main Droll & Lock Bird, but that's still a card that hurts Pendulum Magicians a lot. They're at full power in the TCG and did receive additional support in Narkissus and Black Catbat (I don't think they saw play at Dallas, but they are there, they're not bad, and extra options don't hurt them.) Being a main anime character's deck, they'll likely continue to receive support as well.

 

Don't hold your breath. Droll and Lock bird isn't an argument for any sort of deck unless they have access to something that allows them to use it more reliably. Side-Deck-style counters don't bolster any deck to a point that makes them any better than they otherwise be, otherwise ABC's wouldn't have been as high in their placements as they were.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

I've been running 3 Gofu since Links came out. I understand that the card is good and that it's three Link materials without expending your Normal Summon, it's also much more than that. I gave what I'd already qualified as lesser alternatives to use instead of Gofu, and you shot them down because they're not literally Gofu. That kind of proves my point that players have gotten too reliant on using Gofu as a crutch, and that's not good for the game. Adapt. Replacing second and third copies of Gofu is not that prohibitive a problem to have, and it's a pittance I'd pay to have Quik-Fix and Drone at 1 any day.

 

People need to stop it with the Scapegoat meme, because yes, it is as terrible as we say it is. 

 

Scapegoat has topped, in Trickstars and Invoked, post-CIBR, at very high levels. Any argument that Scapegoat is terrible has already lost. Here's why: not all duels end on the second turn, especially when every third card is a hand trap. Scapegoat will continue to see play, probably more so with Gofu out of the picture. 

 

Who is this "we" you're referring to that says Scapegoat is terrible? Some mafia of YCM cognoscenti who know better than YCS-topping players? 

 

Cyber Dragon isn't a Gofu. It's not plussing, it's not a one-card Link, it's a free summon. That's all it is.

 

Cyber Dragon actually does plus if your opponent controls Extra Monster Zone'd and/or Machine-Type monster(s), which they often do. 

 

None of these are replacements are Gofu, like at all. Gofu's strength was the tokens, not just the free summon, and if I wanted an extra summon spell I'd run, like, frickin' One-Time Security Pass because that at least gives me something that's Cyberse-Type.

 

I thought about mentioning One-Time Passcode actually, but then I asked myself "What Links requiring Cyberse monsters are you running?"

 

That's right, nothing.

 

Instant Fusion is much better, and will be for the foreseeable future.

 

 

Sorry Vector, you know I love you baby. 

[VCR_CAT]

 

Scapegoat has topped, in Trickstars and Invoked, post-CIBR, at very high levels. Any argument that Scapegoat is terrible has already lost. Here's why: not all duels end on the second turn, especially when every third card is a hand trap. Scapegoat will continue to see play, probably more so with Gofu out of the picture. 

 

No, it's not lost. A card seeing random play in a tournament =/= that it's suddenly good. It's honestly pretty dumb to think that Scapegoat fills the Gofu hole when you have to wait a turn to actually use it. It's actually impossible to have that card benefit your opening field because you can't summon anything with it unless you wait. If you're waiting, you're hoping the opponent isn't doing something to remove it, and if they do, that they don't deal with the tokens. There are many, many more ways for that card to not work out than something that you can use immediately.

 

And seriously, "Has topped?" Dinomists topped once, that doesn't mean they're actually good.

 

 

Cyber Dragon actually does plus if your opponent controls Extra Monster Zone'd and/or Machine-Type monster(s), which they often do. 

 

You know full well removal isn't what I meant. If you can't summon a Link 2+ monster using only Cyber Dragon, then it's not plussing in the way you need it to. It's not doing the role you're saying it can fill.

 

 

I thought about mentioning One-Time Passcode actually, but then I asked myself "What Links requiring Cyberse monsters are you running?"

 

That's right, nothing.

 

Instant Fusion is much better, and will be for the foreseeable future.

 

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Encode_Talker You also have Link Disciple to work with on the memes, along with basically the rest of the Cyberse-exclusive Link monsters that become just a bit easier to use.

 

Instant Fusion lost Norden, which means it lost its best use. If I was desperately needing a means to put monsters on the field without adding to my card count, I'd sooner use something that didn't put even more pressure on my extra-deck space. There's only so many empty bodies you can actually put in there before your toolbox begins to really suffer.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

No, it's not lost. A card seeing random play in a tournament =/= that it's suddenly good.

 

It wasn't "random play in a tournament", it was a calculated and successful tech choice in decks that beat out over 97% of the over a thousand competitive players in attendance on a consistent enough basis through 11+ gruelling rounds against the highest waters of a Tier 0 format to prove that at the very least, Scapegoat isn't terrible. It's also seen play at high-level OCG tournaments, and has been in YGOrganization's card rankings for top OCG decklists every week for the past 5 months, since True Draco Zoo was the OCG's best deck. I would wager good money that at least one of the decks that tops YCS San Diego will include Scapegoat. 

 

It's actually impossible to have that card benefit your opening field because you can't summon anything with it unless you wait.

 

Ash Blossom & Joyous Spring doesn't do much for your board on turn 1. Is it terrible? 

 

Setting Scapegoat turn 1 is actually a great compliment to certain opening plays. Cards like Invoked Mechaba, Decode Talker, and Crystal Wing in tandem with hand traps can protect Scapegoat and/or force your opponent to commit resources to both dealing with your boss and dealing damage until your opponent's End Phase when you can flip Scapegoat for a full-fledged counter-push. Activating Scapegoat before then also being an the event your opponent pushes for the OTK or attempts to destroy it doesn't hurt either. Should you be able to pull off a full Scapegoat that's amazing and you can Borreload your opponent's SPYRAL Sleeper, but even a partial success with some Tokens intact can certainly help mount a counterpush as well. 

 

But don't take it from me, take it from Mario Argiro who top 8'd at YCS London, as far as any non-SPYRAL player got in this brief SPYRAL Tier 0 TCG format. 

 

 

1:20 for an enthusiastic "Scapegoat is the best card".

 

And seriously, "Has topped?" Dinomists topped once, that doesn't mean they're actually good.

 

I wouldn't call Dinomists terrible, they could field both Toadally Awesome and Cyber Dragon Infinity in their prime. Shinobirds are terrible. That said, there's also a difference between winning a small tournament in Norway with locals-level double-digit attendance and a full-blown YCS with quadruple-digit attendance. Scapegoat topped multiple times at the YCS's in Dallas and London and has historically been a very strong card. 

 

http://yugioh.wikia.com/wiki/Encode_Talker You also have Link Disciple to work with on the memes, along with basically the rest of the Cyberse-exclusive Link monsters that become just a bit easier to use.

 

Instant Fusion lost Norden, which means it lost its best use. If I was desperately needing a means to put monsters on the field without adding to my card count, I'd sooner use something that didn't put even more pressure on my extra-deck space. There's only so many empty bodies you can actually put in there before your toolbox begins to really suffer.

 

You're worried about your "extra-deck space" but you're running Encode Talker? If you want to play One-Time Passcode and Encode Talker that's fine and I certainly wouldn't discourage you from doing so, just know that they aren't any less terrible than Scapegoat. 

[VCR_CAT]

It wasn't "random play in a tournament", it was a calculated and successful tech choice in decks that beat out over 97% of the over a thousand competitive players in attendance on a consistent enough basis through 11+ gruelling rounds against the highest waters of a Tier 0 format to prove that at the very least, Scapegoat isn't terrible. It's also seen play at high-level OCG tournaments, and has been in YGOrganization's card rankings for top OCG decklists every week for the past 5 months, since True Draco Zoo was the OCG's best deck. I would wager good money that at least one of the decks that tops YCS San Diego will include Scapegoat. 

 

A handful of techs that top a tournament is random play.

 

A staple card that's accepted as a mandatory option in a high-ranking deck is something to pay attention to.

 

 

 

Ash Blossom & Joyous Spring doesn't do much for your board on turn 1. Is it terrible? 

 

How is this an argument? Presenting cards that are never used for the role we are discussing (putting cards on the field and establishing your board) and asking if they're terrible in a role they're never used for in the first place isn't getting you anywhere. Stay on track.

 

 

 

Setting Scapegoat turn 1 is actually a great compliment to certain opening plays.

 

I think that speaks for itself more than enough. Decks like SPYRAL hit tier 0 because they're not waiting a turn to actually put out their board. Scapegoat is complete sheet for establishing turn-1 boards because it's a turn-2 board card. I bet you anything that the deck(s) that move into the top positions in the coming meta aren't going to be """slow""" decks that are waiting a turn to put their stuff out, they're going to be the ones that go hard from the start.

 

 

 

I wouldn't call Dinomists terrible...

 

I never called them terrible, I said they're not good.

 

 

 

You're worried about your "extra-deck space" but you're running Encode Talker? If you want to play One-Time Passcode and Encode Talker that's fine and I certainly wouldn't discourage you from doing so, just know that they aren't any less terrible than Scapegoat. 

 

I never said I was going to run pass-code, I said I'd probably use it over Instant Fusion. Truth be told, I'm not running either because +0 summons aren't good enough these days. If they're not extending combos or helping you plus (read: getting more cards into your possession, not removal), then it's frankly not worth my time if the goal in question is getting a board on the field.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

How is this an argument? Presenting cards that are never used for the role we are discussing (putting cards on the field and establishing your board) and asking if they're terrible in a role they're never used for in the first place isn't getting you anywhere. Stay on track.

 

Denying the merits of any cards as successors to copies of a card that are no longer an option because they don't do the exact same thing isn't "staying on track", it's stubborn narrow-mindedness and it won't get you anywhere. Those second and third copies of Gofu aren't coming back any time soon. When I speak of replacements for Gofu, I speak of cards to replace Gofu with (which is something that has to be done barring decks over 40 cards), not cards that perfectly emulate Gofu's niche, and I'm glad there aren't cards that perfectly emulate Gofu's niche so we can find new cards to fill the hole left by its absence. There are no other cards that instantly generate 3 Link Materials by themselves without using your Normal Summon. There are similarities in the potential plusses a card like Cyber Dragon can provide because plusses are plusses regardless of whether they build your board or take down an opponent's. If a Gofu builds a 1-card Decode Talker or something better in the EMZ without using a Normal Summon, a second-turn Cyber Dragon can net you even more advantage by being 1 card that can both take it away and put up a Megafleet in its place. That's a more relevant example in some decks than others and less relevant than Gofu in a lot of decks that used Gofu, but for every deck that lost copies of Gofu there's an option out there and I'd rather think about what to use moving forward than get caught up in the past and whine about how Gofu's limit is inconvenient when I don't think the level of splashability and ease of use that Gofu provided was a good thing for the game or promoted much creativity and diversity in players' decks. 

 

Evidently my rhetorical question involving Ash didn't register. Your argument for Scapegoat being terrible is that it doesn't contribute to your turn 1 board as Gofu did. Neither does Ash and it's obviously a good card, ergo a card needn't contribute to your turn 1 board to be better than terrible.  

 

I never called them terrible, I said they're not good.

 

And I never said you did, merely that I wouldn't call them terrible. So at least we're in agreement on Dinomists being somewhere between good and terrible.

 

I never said I was going to run pass-code, I said I'd probably use it over Instant Fusion. Truth be told, I'm not running either because +0 summons aren't good enough these days. If they're not extending combos or helping you plus (read: getting more cards into your possession, not removal), then it's frankly not worth my time if the goal in question is getting a board on the field.

 

I interpreted you posting a link to Encode Talker as a rebuttal to my argument that there aren't any Links worth running requiring Cyberse materials as provided by One-Time Passcode, but if that's not what you meant then that's all well and good as I feel that we'd both be saving our time by neglecting Encode Talker's existence. 

 

Either way Instant Fusion is a better card in a broader range of decks because it allows for much more versatility, and I'd rather dedicate Extra Deck space to Instant Fusion targets than to Encode Talker.

[VCR_CAT]

Denying the merits of any cards as successors to copies of a card that are no longer an option because they don't do the exact same thing isn't "staying on track", it's stubborn narrow-mindedness and it won't get you anywhere. Those second and third copies of Gofu aren't coming back any time soon. When I speak of replacements for Gofu, I speak of cards to replace Gofu with (which is something that has to be done barring decks over 40 cards), not cards that perfectly emulate Gofu's niche, and I'm glad there aren't cards that perfectly emulate Gofu's niche so we can find new cards to fill the hole left by its absence. There are no other cards that instantly generate 3 Link Materials by themselves without using your Normal Summon. There are similarities in the potential plusses a card like Cyber Dragon can provide because plusses are plusses regardless of whether they build your board or take down an opponent's. If a Gofu builds a 1-card Decode Talker or something better in the EMZ without using a Normal Summon, a second-turn Cyber Dragon can net you even more advantage by being 1 card that can both take it away and put up a Megafleet in its place. That's a more relevant example in some decks than others and less relevant than Gofu in a lot of decks that used Gofu, but for every deck that lost copies of Gofu there's an option out there and I'd rather think about what to use moving forward than get caught up in the past and whine about how Gofu's limit is inconvenient when I don't think the level of splashability and ease of use that Gofu provided was a good thing for the game or promoted much creativity and diversity in players' decks. 

 

The problem is that your argument is a false equivalence. Ash doesn't work as a comparison because its role is primarily disruption, while Scapegoat DOES compare to Gofu because they try to do the same thing: generate cards to use as materials or to wall-up, and the biggest problem with Scapegoat is the speed that it operates; it's way too slow for this game, and if you want to go back and see either me or Black (or Giga if at any point he said so as well) iterate again and again: it's way too slow. Ultimately those decks that played in a tournament? They're not the tier 0 deck, they didn't win the 90% majority of representation of decks played. A rogue deck may top (as that's what a deck needs to do to become rogue), but because it topped that doesn't mean that it or the cards it used are tier 1, even if it meant beating the highest ranked competition. At the end of the day, it's still rogue; it's still below tier 3.

 

I will continue to argue that Gofu was frickin' great for the game, because it helped decks get their plays going. In the context of decks such as U.A., it helped them tremendously not only as one-card play that allowed them to spoop out any dangerous disruption, but they could play between either going into Skulldeat, which just helps them establish a board and actually get some draw power for once, or go into Missus Radiant while offering Gofu itself as tribute material, which helped reduce bricked hands. Similar deals go for other casual decks, that having this power play actively helped them get their decks rolling, and it helped enable a greater variety of decks and strategies in Link format. This is good. I argue it did, in fact, promote creativity and diversity because it brought more decks into the mix and allowed them to play.

 

As it stands, hitting Gofu doesn't help anyone. It doesn't shift the balance of power, it doesn't nerf the top deck(s), it doesn't prevent dangerous FTK's, it doesn't help players get into the mix without needing exorbitantly expensive cards. Hitting Gofu only accomplishes making the game less fun for a lot of different decks, it's honestly a really dumb hit at this stage in the game. (not to say that hitting it later isn't fine; I'd rather they waited for other, good, generic link engines to rise to the mix before hitting one of the only good engines for a lot of decks.) This hit doesn't promote creative play, all it does is boot down the decks that can't adapt to newer formats as easily as the more relevant decks can.

 

Right now, the only good replacements really are Destrudo engines, which while good those don't fit into nearly as many decks, or Grinder Golem, which isn't as terribly effective in the TCG format as it is right now because we don't have access to all the cards that allow it to shine. Cards like Instant Fusion, Cyber Dragon, Security Pass (though play that in MPB's; it triggers the monsters and they can use it for plays), or Scapegoat don't work to help those decks at all. Free summon monsters don't kickstart plays or combos unless they have effects to back them, and, again, Scapegoat is too slow for this kind of metagame.

 

 

Evidently my rhetorical question involving Ash didn't register. Your argument for Scapegoat being terrible is that it doesn't contribute to your turn 1 board as Gofu did. Neither does Ash and it's obviously a good card, ergo a card needn't contribute to your turn 1 board to be better than terrible.  

 

That's because it's a false equivalence. We're talking about cards that establish your turn one board, something that you're suggesting that Scapegoat do. Ash doesn't do the same thing as either of those cards while Gofu and Spapegoat more or less do, the biggest difference being speed and timing. The argument doesn't stand, and if you're replacing engine cards with hand traps then your deck is absolutely going to suffer in functionality as a whole, whether those hand traps are good or not.

 

 

Either way Instant Fusion is a better card in a broader range of decks because it allows for much more versatility, and I'd rather dedicate Extra Deck space to Instant Fusion targets than to Encode Talker.

 

That's your choice. I lean more towards Encode in a variety of decks because it fills that UTL niche of being a boss-buster card, but being more available for decks that can't easily access the rank 4 pool. It's simple to ladder into, and for the decks that already ran Gofu, they already the cards needed to ladder into it because they needed them for Decode or other cards. It just worked; I didn't need to shoe-horn in normal Utopia, and I already had the cards needed to summon it.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

The problem is that your argument is a false equivalence. 

 

Except it's not because I'm not trying to convince you that any of these cards are equal to Gofu, just that they're cards to replace Gofu with, of which there are many. You could replace Gofu with extra copies of Terraforming and U.A. Penalty Box for all I care. I'm just brainstorming some general ideas.

 

Ash doesn't work as a comparison because its role is primarily disruption, while Scapegoat DOES compare to Gofu because they try to do the same thing: generate cards to use as materials or to wall-up, and the biggest problem with Scapegoat is the speed that it operates;

 

As I said, I brought up Ash within the context of "cards that don't do things for your first turn board", because that was a complaint you had with Scapegoat. Ash does in fact compromise your potential for first turn plays and combos in most decks that play it - but it's still a very good card - so this alone shouldn't be a prohibitive factor.

 

Ultimately those decks that played in a tournament? They're not the tier 0 deck, they didn't win the 90% majority of representation of decks played.

 

You're going from "if it's not in the tier 0 deck in a tier 0 format it's irrelevant" to talking up Encode Talker and how important Gofu was to decks like U.A.

 

As it stands, hitting Gofu doesn't help anyone. It doesn't shift the balance of power, it doesn't nerf the top deck(s), it doesn't prevent dangerous FTK's, it doesn't help players get into the mix without needing exorbitantly expensive cards. Hitting Gofu only accomplishes making the game less fun for a lot of different decks, it's honestly a really dumb hit at this stage in the game. (not to say that hitting it later isn't fine; I'd rather they waited for other, good, generic link engines to rise to the mix before hitting one of the only good engines for a lot of decks.) This hit doesn't promote creative play, all it does is boot down the decks that can't adapt to newer formats as easily as the more relevant decks can.

 

Any decks that stuggled to adapt to Link format weren't going to make better use of Gofu than those that transitioned well. I don't think there's a huge difference whether they hit it now or in a couple months when Needlefiber, Skulldeat etc are a thing.

 

the biggest problem with Scapegoat is the speed that it operates; it's way too slow for this game, and if you want to go back and see either me or Black (or Giga if at any point he said so as well) iterate again and again: it's way too slow.

 

With all due respect to you, Black (or Giga if he said so as well lol), the idea of any of you guys telling Mario Argiro that Scapegoat is a terrible card that's way too slow for the game after it helped him to the best performance of his life is hilarious.

 

It's already been proven fast enough for the metagame at the height of SPYRAL dominance, multiple times at YCS, which is why persisting in this line of argument that Scapegoat is terrible is willful ignorance of tangible results the likes of which nobody active in YCM's TCG section today has ever achieved.

 

Scapegoat's a card with utility in Invoked, Trickstars, Paleozoics and any number of other decks that just got a lot more viable as a direct result of this list. Scapegoat has seen play in the meta since the meta existed, it has since seen successful competitive play every single year since it was released in 2003, and it will see more as time progresses and new summoning mechanics are introduced. Please stop calling it terrible - it makes you look bad. 

 

That's your choice. I lean more towards Encode in a variety of decks because it fills that UTL niche of being a boss-buster card, but being more available for decks that can't easily access the rank 4 pool. It's simple to ladder into, and for the decks that already ran Gofu, they already the cards needed to ladder into it because they needed them for Decode or other cards. It just worked; I didn't need to shoe-horn in normal Utopia, and I already had the cards needed to summon it.

 

As far as boss-busting Link 3s go Ningirsu's seen a lot of play (Encode's seen none in the time it's been available to the OCG). Ningirsu's effect provides for non-targeting non-destroying Scrap Dragon-esque removal. It's pretty versatile and was commonly used to out Set Rotation in addition to taking out any opponent's card. It should be at least as generic as Encode and is easily laddered into. I don't know how good it'd be in U.A.'s though.

 

I find that given all that has to happen to pull off Encode's effect there are other cards that can get the job done with less risk (you need Encode and another Linked monster to attack into your opponent's monster without Utopia-esque protection, at which point you might as well have gone into Borreload Dragon which at least has some protection and can take your opponent's monster). But whatever works.

[VCR_CAT]

Except it's not because I'm not trying to convince you that any of these cards are equal to Gofu, just that they're cards to replace Gofu with, of which there are many. You could replace Gofu with extra copies of Terraforming and U.A. Penalty Box for all I care. I'm just brainstorming some general ideas.

 

 

As I said, I brought up Ash within the context of "cards that don't do things for your first turn board", because that was a complaint you had with Scapegoat. Ash does in fact compromise your potential for first turn plays and combos in most decks that play it - but it's still a very good card - so this alone shouldn't be a prohibitive factor.

 

Honestly, when it comes to replacing cards that are lost to the banlist, it's better to find something that either fits the same role at the same or greater quality (I replaced a Terrortop engine in U.A.'s with Gofu, for instance). Simply replacing it with good cards that accomplish different things will hurt your deck, and you don't want to suggest just any ol' good card to replace a lost chunk of a deck unless there are absolutely no other adequate options. And if that's the case, then the deck's probably just going to have to deal with that injury until future/better support is released.

 

 

Any deck that stuggled to adapt to Link format weren't going to make better use of Gofu than those that could. I don't think there's a huge difference whether they hit it now or in a couple months when Needlefiber, Skulldeat etc are a thing.

 

I disagree. Each deck used it to the same outcome (Missus/Decode/Skulldeat); for Gofu itself they used it to the same effectiveness and the same result. The difference is what the deck as a whole operates with that as an engine piece. This is a key distinction, and as far as generic power cards go, allow me to draw a comparison to Terrortop.

 

Terrortop was a card that resulted in a one-card Rank 3, typically Invoker. Most decks that could use Invoker's effect could use Terrortop and its result. However, the difference being that Invoker searched a specific kind of monster and brought it out. Terrortop, and by extension, Invoker, was used to vastly different degrees of quality if it was summoning Ratpier instead of Midfielder; that's a key example of a generic tech being used better in some decks than others.

 

Neither Decode nor Missus have that same effect; they do the same things for any deck that uses it (except Missus in non-EARTH decks but you get what I mean). Even Skulldeat offered the same gain, the same summon, the same result for any deck. No deck used these cards any better than the other, realistically, as they're not searching or working with specific kinds of cards. Any sort of difference with how it's used is really up to how the deck operates as a whole, which doesn't change if it's hit or not.

 

I can't imagine myself wording this very well, so I hope I'm getting the idea across. Each deck is using Gofu the same, essentially. There's no difference in what's being used in its combos, it's just up to the deck as a whole to play as well as it does. Gofu's existence alone doesn't make one deck inherently better than the other. The difference, really, is that the better decks have a wider range of options to go into, including (but not limited to) their own engines. It's the decks that don't have that benefit that begin to suffer significantly.

 

 

 

With all due respect to you, Black (or Giga if he said so as well lol), the idea of any of you guys telling Mario Argiro that Scapegoat is a terrible card that's way too slow for the game after it helped him to the best performance of his life is hilarious.

 

It's already been proven fast enough for the metagame at the height of SPYRAL dominance, multiple times at YCS, which is why persisting in this line of argument that Scapegoat is terrible is willful ignorance of tangible results the likes of which nobody active in YCM's TCG section today has ever achieved.

 

I was right about Giga, among other names as far as YCM's group of experienced players go: https://forum.yugiohcardmaker.net/topic/365695-lets-discuss-the-giant-goat-in-the-room-scapegoat/page-1

 

(don't comment in that thread; that'd be necro-bumping).

 

Again, a rogue deck that tops does not mean that it becomes a higher tier; it holds little to no implications for the format as a whole or what's going to change. Scapegoat is still a bad option if you need link engines; instant value will always trump delayed value.

 

 

 

As far as boss-busting Link 3s go Ningirsu's seen a lot of play (Encode's seen none in the time it's been available to the OCG). Ningirsu's effect provides for non-targeting non-destroying Scrap Dragon-esque removal. It's pretty versatile and was commonly used to out Set Rotation in addition to taking out any opponent's card. It should be at least as generic as Encode and is easily laddered into. I don't know how good it'd be in U.A.'s though.

 

I find that given all that has to happen to pull off Encode's effect there are other cards that can get the job done with less risk (you need Encode and another Linked monster to attack into your opponent's monster without Utopia-esque protection, at which point you might as well have gone into Borreload Dragon which at least has some protection and can take your opponent's monster). But whatever works.

 

It depends on how one wants to go about it. Ningirsu is strong removal, it's just not what I'm going for. In U.A.'s it won't be as good; I know that deck struggles for non-battlephase removal, but Extra Deck options have existed for them in the past, and being a Link doesn't change that the deck still would need to go out of its way for the removal, which means losing significant advantage and momentum. In the context of other decks, removal isn't typically what I'm lacking. I try to have my bases covered, and something that accomplishes nothing more than smacking a target really hard with strong stats is something I try to have in every deck. Lacking that option can really screw over a deck in a variety of situations, and so far Encode is the only adequate option to accomplish that.

 

Hopefully something better fills that gap soon.

[~ P O L A R I S ~]

I was right about Giga, among other names as far as YCM's group of experienced players go: https://forum.yugiohcardmaker.net/topic/365695-lets-discuss-the-giant-goat-in-the-room-scapegoat/page-1

 

(don't comment in that thread; that'd be necro-bumping).

 

Sleepy had by far the most intelligent things to say in that thread.

 

(ya i know lol; so I necro-liked Sleepy's posts instead)