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I'd suggest that there are more just and ultimately joyous pastimes out there than property damage including the shattering of others' houses. 

 

For starters, this proverb has a symbolic, personal meaning to me, which ties in with the treatment of homosexuals in other countries. As the sun begins to set on homophobia, it’s curious to think that in middle eastern and African countries, being gay is still a capital crime punishable by stoning.

 

"Tying in" the plight of tortured Africans with your own is not convincing, especially within the overarching framework of your encounters with internet trolls.

 

If backing down is not an option—since that only isolates you further from the population—how can you shatter their glass house before they dent yours?

 

Backing down doesn't necessarily lead to isolation, there are other ways of making acquaintances than picking fights with people. I recommend Craigslist.

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Co-exist. Don't think of others as "enemy or ally". You don't need to agree with someone to get along with them. Nor do you have to get along with someone to agree with something they say.

Justice doesn't have to be "defeating one who is unjust". Not to mention your definition of victory in this case would be using their words against them and having them be mocked instead.

 

In my experience it's always better to joke around amicably. If they get upset by this or get more vicious then they have crossed the line of joking into actual mocking. Which is the point where it's best to step away and take it to a third party.

For instance recently my friend told me on Facebook how someone was arguing about a certain topic over and over and asked if I could help out because the arguing was getting frustrating.

I made a joke about the situation, not about the person, and the status instead turned to a friendly environment.

 

Basically what I'm saying is that the only way to "win" is to play a different game. You don't need some great strategy or intentionally go out of your way to best someone who is usually just messing around. Trying to seriously dismantle someone who wasn't serious in the first place is fundamentally impossible.

 

If you for some reason cannot ignore a troll either play along to a point you're comfortable with or get another perspective to look at things. Remember not to try and "counter" them by pointing out a flaw or mocking them back.

 

I'm rambling...it's past midnight which means my brain is no longer what it should be so idek if any of this makes sense.

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Depends if someone's view is directly detrimental to yours cowcow

 

There is something called "mutually exclusive"

 

You might want to elaborate more, because atm you're making it sound like someone is actually incapable of being civil in the same space as another person who shares a polar-opposite view to their own. What's mutually exclusive, the people themselves or the views? Because Cow is just talking about just leaving it be and going about your business.

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Depends if someone's view is directly detrimental to yours cowcow

 

There is something called "mutually exclusive"

I'd love to hear how a Jew should coexist with a Nazi or Palastinian

 

My first thought when reading this was: Can I not, as a Christian, become friends and co-exist with devout Atheists? They may think my views in regards to religion are stupid, misguided, irrational, uneducated or just plain wrong, but we can agree on other points. Just because part of our beliefs don't mesh, and we each think each other short-sighted in that area, but there's more to interaction than that.

 

Unfortunately, as I realized upon thinking about it, beliefs don't  normally stay inside one's head. They lead us to make actions and decisions, and if the other person's views lead them to see our actions as wrong, they're then prompted to do something about it. And, quite often, beliefs lead to prejudices, as in Dad's comment.

 

Coexisting is something you can only do on the internet. Don't try that crock of sheet in real life. Move along and find happiness. You can't coexist with someone who hates you.

 

You can get over differences and disagreements in regards to passive ideas and stances. There's more to life than that. You can't get over people actively trying to stamp on your actions and perhaps on you as a person. And, if they hold to said beliefs passionately, there's not much you can do about that.

 


However, this topic isn't about real life (at least, that's what I gathered); this is about the anonymous world of the internet.

 

The problem is, in an anonymous world, how can I enact justice?

Justice, despite being seen as objective by those with clear ideas on it, is largely subjective. Whoever is in power gets to enact justice as they see fit, and one has to understand what they can and can't do online.

 

Why do I, who projects myself, have to suffer for doing so?

Not all people are nice. Not all people are selfless. In fact, some could argue that most people aren't. If you're going to interact with people, you risk the chance of suffering for doing pretty much anything.

 

This isn't a question I can answer objectively, as it delves into the morality of people, of which many philosophies and religion are built. I believe that people are inherently "evil", but not everyone believes that.

 

Why does the jester have a more favorable role in this court than the heir to the throne?

Your morality does not determine your hierarchy in society. You might argue that this is your point, but if so, what makes you the heir to the throne? You might be infinitely more wise and kind than anyone else, but that doesn't automatically place in you or imply your placement in our world. A government is controlled and assigned by itself, aside from revolutions, and is up to them to select roles, not you.

 

How can you identify the glass houses of others? How can you use the words of trolls against them?

If they throw stones at your glass house, how different is throwing stones back at them, intentionally and with forethought? You could easily, almost certainly make the situation worse by inspiring the same thing within them, and there might even be collateral damage.

 

In what ways can one gain the allegiance of those who would otherwise laugh at you and with the troll?

So, in other words, gaining the allegiance of another troll? What differentiates the one who would do the same as you; are you assuming a "Troll" is someone who is irredeemably lost in the stone throwing? 

 

Regardless, trying to do this is perfectly valid. You want someone who can help patch up your house after an assault; someone willing to go under fire in order to make a friend. And, perhaps, you will eventually patch up their house if some stones go flying that way.

 

But of course, the question doesn't ask this. As to how you would go about getting a buddy, it depends on the person. If you start throwing stones at the troll back, the would-be troll would probably join with the person who seems the most confident, or who's views seems the most like their own. It's not something you can control, unless you have some level of power or influence within the system. 

 

Assume ignoring them is not possible. Hypothetically, if you ignore them, something wretched happens.

If backing down is not an option—since that only isolates you further from the population—how can you shatter their glass house before they dent yours?

...what?

 

At least you elaborate on why it may not be an option, but...it is always an option. You say you become isolated from a population, but...isn't that the purpose of ignoring someone(s)? You're trying to isolate yourself away from them, and if you end up pushing away a community who is behind them, either you're doing the ignoring far too much, or you shouldn't really be trying to be part of that community in the first place.

 

If we do ignore ignoring it it, I still don't believe direct retaliation is the only option. There is appealing to others, attempting to get help, and there are means of responding directly that do not involve throwing stones; you have the moral high ground, so keep it there. A kind answer may not always turn away wrath, but it should have difficulty provoking it.

 

I can't say I really relate to suffering online. Even in the many continuous years I have been bullied at school, I have always found people who are suffering as well, and we managed to survive together. But, sometimes you cannot find someone. Sometimes you have to struggle on your own. I, in my ignorance, can only encourage you to try and move beyond, but it may not seem achievable to everyone, hell, anyone reading this. But still, I try.

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This thread was a mistake

[spoiler=Long Post]

I'd suggest that there are more just and ultimately joyous pastimes out there than property damage including the shattering of others' houses.

 

It’s a figure of speech. A proverb. I didn’t realize I needed to say that. And why would you say that to me when it’s my house being shattered?

 

"Tying in" the plight of tortured Africans with your own is not convincing, especially within the overarching framework of your encounters with internet trolls.

 

Here we have a beautiful example of a strawman argument, in which you alter my argument to mean that my circumstances are somehow comparable to every single person in Africa who has been tortured. What I actually stated was that I recognize the dire conditions these people are living in (especially in the Middle East, but Africa was an honorable mention) and it brings me hope that progress will inevitably give them refuge. But of course, to make me look bad, it’s much easier for you to say that I was trying to compare myself to someone in these circumstances. You do seem to have a fetish for making people compare their situations to others so that they can feel like their problems are meaningless, which I suppose explains this.

 

Backing down doesn't necessarily lead to isolation, there are other ways of making acquaintances than picking fights with people. I recommend Craigslist.

Craigslist sounds like a nice way to get killed, but that’s a debate for another day.

If you think I don’t know what I’m talking about when I say that not defending yourself will get people to think of you as a joke, you were probably not active during late 2015-2016. I was a wreck. People like Enguin would always try to make me feel like sheet so they could get a laugh, and nothing was done about it. I knew 100% that Enguin was a joke, but everyone else laughed with him. Even though Enguin was a joke, he was funny. So this isn’t about making acquaintances, it’s about overcoming those who vehemently try to bring you down.

 

Now we’re having a resurgence. I’m not going to name other names but you know who I’m talking about. So much of their energy is focused on trying to make me look bad that it has driven me to hate myself. I cannot report them for a joke because that would just be a false report. The only way to get them to back off is to prove to them that what they’re doing is not acceptable.

 

Co-exist. Don't think of others as "enemy or ally". You don't need to agree with someone to get along with them. Nor do you have to get along with someone to agree with something they say.

Justice doesn't have to be "defeating one who is unjust". Not to mention your definition of victory in this case would be using their words against them and having them be mocked instead.

 

In my experience it's always better to joke around amicably. If they get upset by this or get more vicious then they have crossed the line of joking into actual mocking. Which is the point where it's best to step away and take it to a third party.

For instance recently my friend told me on Facebook how someone was arguing about a certain topic over and over and asked if I could help out because the arguing was getting frustrating.

I made a joke about the situation, not about the person, and the status instead turned to a friendly environment.

 

Basically what I'm saying is that the only way to "win" is to play a different game. You don't need some great strategy or intentionally go out of your way to best someone who is usually just messing around. Trying to seriously dismantle someone who wasn't serious in the first place is fundamentally impossible.

 

If you for some reason cannot ignore a troll either play along to a point you're comfortable with or get another perspective to look at things. Remember not to try and "counter" them by pointing out a flaw or mocking them back.

 

I'm rambling...it's past midnight which means my brain is no longer what it should be so idek if any of this makes sense.

I’d like to point out that when you write long post it’s “rambling” but when I do it it’s “ranting.” Probably due to the fact that it’s what father wants you to say.

 

This mentality sounds naive. You, as YCM’s figurehead (perhaps not as much now because you have mod powers), are only hated by those who envy you—people who exist. Their forum presence is minimal, so they never go after you, and their merits are rather low, so you essentially outshine them in the regards that they would attack. You have also figured out the algorithm for expressing yourself without getting trolled by too many people in the first place.

 

I do, however, appreciate your suggestions. They do not directly answer the question, but I shouldn’t have expected anyone to know the secret formula to this. I have tried this in the past with limited success, but perhaps I wasn’t adaptable enough.

 

Coexisting is something you can only do on the internet. Don't try that crock of sheet in real life. Move along and find happiness. You can't coexist with someone who hates you.

Your Killmonger is showing

 

I'd love to hear how a Jew should coexist with a Nazi or Palastinian

Everyone knows this and is trying to disprove it but cannot.

 

Best way to deal with internet trolls is to turn off your PC/Laptop/Tablet/Phone, IMO.

 

Not this sheet again

You’re right. If people decide to make me a victim, I should be the better person and just not use electronic devices.

I don’t have a creative way to say that this is naive.

The latter half of this post also explains what I mean when “everyone knows this and is trying to disprove it but cannot.”

 

 

I will leave this topic open on the condition that we do not go down the rabbit holes of:

 

1. Africans have way worse circumstances than I do

2. Coexistence is impossible among people of different races and ideologies (or just race debates at all. If you want a race debate go to debates)

 

To be frank I mostly wanted to vent and post a cool song, so I shouldn’t have expected too many serious answers. From this I have taken away a few things:

 

1. Friction will naturally occur between those with varying loci of control

2. There is, in fact, a way to beat trolls, but they cannot be attacked the same way that those who do not troll can.

 

Here is my analogy:

• Normal people do not attack others or put themselves out there

• Trolls Attack others but do not put themselves out there

• Spotlight-seekers (“Artists” for shorthand) put themselves out there but do not attack other people

 

Trolls will naturally go for Artists, because the artists do not have the shield of anonymity and their flaws are extremely apparent. Normal people have an edge against trolls because they completely neutralize trolls; that is, by refusing to instigate or create something that the troll would attack, the troll ends up bored and departs.

 

Since being trolled while putting yourself out there may be inevitable, how do you recognize that you are right and the troll is wrong? Oftentimes I find that most people like the troll more than me, and even if I can joke along with them, it leaves a bitter taste in my mouth. How can I ignore everyone when I need to interact with them to enjoy myself?

 

PS: Answer the question this time and don’t misrepresent my argument

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I’d like to point out that when you write long post it’s “rambling” but when I do it it’s “ranting.” Probably due to the fact that it’s what father wants you to say.

 

This mentality sounds naive. You, as YCM’s figurehead (perhaps not as much now because you have mod powers), are only hated by those who envy you—people who exist. Their forum presence is minimal, so they never go after you, and their merits are rather low, so you essentially outshine them in the regards that they would attack. You have also figured out the algorithm for expressing yourself without getting trolled by too many people in the first place.

 

I do, however, appreciate your suggestions. They do not directly answer the question, but I shouldn’t have expected anyone to know the secret formula to this. I have tried this in the past with limited success, but perhaps I wasn’t adaptable enough.

First, the reason I said rambling was because I was tired and just dumping thoughts out. Ranting implies impassioned speech. idk what you're referring to as you posting long things being ranting. I mean no one called this a rant yet right?

Second who is father and why do you think I care what he thinks?

 

I have often been targeted by trolls and hate. I've been here a long time and have been public and open for a long time. I've gotten a lot of sheet.

There is no "Algorithm" or if there is idk what I've done to "figure it out". Beyond what I already said. Honestly I'm not sure what you're actually looking for here. I feel there has been several possible answers given but you seem to dismiss them so it almost feels you're looking for something specific.

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For some reason, Isaac has this delusion that I'm a master puppeteer controlling the movements of the mod team through my impeccable wit and influence.

 

Meanwhile I'm tryna get the funk out this jabroni lmao.

 

And no jabroni, even on a game show you can't coexist with the enemy. If I was Killmonger I'd do a lot more killing.

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1. Friction will naturally occur between those with varying loci of control

2. There is, in fact, a way to beat trolls, but they cannot be attacked the same way that those who do not troll can.

 

Here is my analogy:

• Normal people do not attack others or put themselves out there

• Trolls Attack others but do not put themselves out there

• Spotlight-seekers (“Artists” for shorthand) put themselves out there but do not attack other people

 

Trolls will naturally go for Artists, because the artists do not have the shield of anonymity and their flaws are extremely apparent. Normal people have an edge against trolls because they completely neutralize trolls; that is, by refusing to instigate or create something that the troll would attack, the troll ends up bored and departs.

 

Since being trolled while putting yourself out there may be inevitable, how do you recognize that you are right and the troll is wrong? Oftentimes I find that most people like the troll more than me, and even if I can joke along with them, it leaves a bitter taste in my mouth. How can I ignore everyone when I need to interact with them to enjoy myself?

 

PS: Answer the question this time and don’t misrepresent my argument

ok

 

As someone who's intimately familiar with trolling, I need to say:

 

You can only "beat" a troll by successfully trolling them back. If you find yourself getting angry or even emotionally invested, the troll has won. The only way to actually counteract trolling is to use the same callous disregard for others that they use on you. This is the kind of thing that backfires immensely if the person in question isn't actually trolling so it's best to either not bother engaging or spend upwards of 15 years on the internet so you're more easily capable of recognizing such a thing.

 

This is why trolling is a art. It's an harder artform than most people give it credit for.

 

Legitimate criticism doesn't come from randos on the internet telling you that you're sheet. It's best not to care whether or not you're right (IN THIS CONTEXT, NOT IN ALMOST LITERALLY ANYTHING ELSE IN LIFE) when dealing with this.

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