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U.S. Government Set to Shutdown for Third Time This Year


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#1
Nathanael D. Striker

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https://www.cnn.com/...down/index.html

Government shutdowns, once a rarity, are now becoming commonplace. For this one, I put the blame on President Trump.

https://www.washingt...ee6f_story.html

Earlier this week, Trump signaled he would be willing to back off his border wall demands to sign a short-term funding bill to keep the Government afloat until February. With that in mind, the Senate overwhelming passed a short-term funding bill with no border wall funding; however...

https://www.washingt...c9e4_story.html

...Trump backpedaled and reinstating his demands, which frustrated Senators who had gone home already for Christmas. This was especially true after the House passed a short-term funding bill with border wall funding.

Since the two bills have yet to be reconciled, a shutdown starts in two and a half hours.

So, what are your thoughts on this? What should be done?

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#2
Ryusei the Morning Star

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Conservatives say the government is bloated and not needed. Here's a perfect opportunity to show that's true


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#3
Nathanael D. Striker

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And the shutdown started an hour ago. Let's see how long it lasts, shall we?

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#4
Ryusei the Morning Star

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And the shutdown started an hour ago. Let's see how long it lasts, shall we?

Long may she reign 


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#5
Nathanael D. Striker

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Long may she reign

CBS News: Senate adjourning until after Christmas with government partially shut down — live updates.
https://www.cbsnews....=CNM-00-10aag7e

Merry Christmas, then. Not the best way to end the year.

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#6
Ryusei the Morning Star

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CBS News: Senate adjourning until after Christmas with government partially shut down — live updates.
https://www.cbsnews....=CNM-00-10aag7e

Merry Christmas, then. Not the best way to end the year.

 

How President Trump is handling the protection of U.S. borders: Approve 53% Disapprove 43% (NPR/PBS NewsHour/Marist Poll, 11/28 - 12/4/18)

 

http://www.pollingre...om/trump_ad.htm


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#7
Nathanael D. Striker

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How President Trump is handling the protection of U.S. borders: Approve 53% Disapprove 43% (NPR/PBS NewsHour/Marist Poll, 11/28 - 12/4/18)
 
http://www.pollingre...om/trump_ad.htm


Oh hey, a non-partisan poll (NPR/PBS). Still not worth shutting down the Government for, imo; however, I get why Trump is doing this. It's his last chance to get it before divided Government.

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#8
mido9

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Oh hey, a non-partisan poll (NPR/PBS). Still not worth shutting down the Government for, imo; however, I get why Trump is doing this. It's his last chance to get it before divided Government.

I mean it's not like he's asking for ALL the money, it's 5 billion dollars, or 1/1000th of the ~3.8 trillion yearly budget even if you use the bigger cost of 20 billion it's 1/250, that's probably more money than was not spent just in these shutdowns.

 

Pretty much the only reason to oppose it is that you don't want to enforce the border, period.




 

 

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#9
vla1ne

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Pretty much the only reason to oppose it is that you don't want to enforce the border, period.

That's the wrong path of thought. it's not that they don't want to enforce the border, it's that they can't see what good a wall will do. Some people really do not see the value of placing a physical barrier between america and mexico. Others cannot see the value in spending what is, to them, a massive amount of money (even if it only amounts to a drop in the bucket for the budget as a whole). The inability to see both sides of the argument is what lead to this in the first place.

 

I personally think trumps doing the right thing, Republicans, the ones closest to his side atm, have refused to back him when they could, Which is what's been making the entire project stall up to this point. It's pretty much a fact that democrats are going to stonewall this hard af once they get into office as well. Trump is playing full on hardball at this point because all other options have been kicked off the table by the republicans before the democrats even got the ability to. 


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#10
Phantom Roxas

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Didn't Trump throw a hissy fit about Obama, saying that the president should be fired if the government shuts down?

 

Would be curious if he still believes that.


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#11
Ryusei the Morning Star

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Didn't Obama in his 2013 SOTU support a barrier on the border? Wonder if he still believes that

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#12
Nathanael D. Striker

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Didn't Obama in his 2013 SOTU support a barrier on the border? Wonder if he still believes that


You know, Trump could just extend the border fences already in place. There are about 580 miles of actual border fence when the border is almost 2,000 miles. Building The Great Wall of America is a waste of money when cheaper, less politically charged options exist. But of course, Trump's gotta have his Great Wall of America.

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#13
Ryusei the Morning Star

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You know, Trump could just extend the border fences already in place. There are about 580 miles of actual border fence when the border is almost 2,000 miles. Building The Great Wall of America is a waste of money when cheaper, less politically charged options exist. But of course, Trump's gotta have his Great Wall of America.

An 8 month pregnant woman scaled the fence and delivered her infant all in the span of a few hours. That fence sure works /s


https://www.google.c...0-mile-trip.amp

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#14
Nathanael D. Striker

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POLITICO: Congress appears to give up on ending shutdown.
https://www.politico...hursday-1075993

How am I not surprised? Looks like the Divided 116th Congress gets to deal with it now.

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#15
Phantom Roxas

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https://theintercept...own-reelection/
 
Although the Senate has enough votes from both parties to reopen the government, this all comes down to Mitch McConnell blocking any efforts to reopen the government, because he refuses to break from Trump. He is up for reelection next year, and given that he has the lowest approval rating among currently sitting senators, he is desperate to keep his seat.

"He has steered clear of negotiations to end the shutdown, now in its fourth week. He rejected a compromise proposal from his own caucus to consider exchanging protections for Dreamers for wall funding."

 

This line stands out, because despite Trump's constant attempts to blame Democrats for the shutdown (Despite his promises not to do exactly that), it's plainly clear that Trump and McConnell have done far more to avoid making any compromise. Democrats have "come to the table", as it were, while Trump pounded in his fists on that table and walked out like a spoiled child angry he didn't get his shiny new Lego set.


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#16
vla1ne

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That's not quite the whole story though. Trump started out asking for 20 billion, and was respectful enough to hold off on holding the vote until the elections were over. post elections, democrats realized they would be able to hold out against trump no matter what, and shoved his wall funding bill back at the republicans, trump continuously lowered his request, till we hit the point now where it's literally a drop in the bucket compared to what we give out to foreign nations. This is the wall he has run on from day one. It's the flagship of his policy and there is nobody who doesn't know that. politicians on both sides have been begging for some form of barrier not ten years past, and some are actually  on record shitting on bush for his fence not being enough of one. Border security overwhelmingly supports the wall being funded and built, we have fledgling stats telling us that where the wall has already been built, illegal immigration related problems (aka gangs, drugs, human trafficking, ect) have fallen noticeably, and no matter who the blame falls on, trump has cut back enough money from his request that it's almost laughable that it hasn't been granted at this point (20+ billion to 5.5 billion is a massive reduction in asking price). We can ridicule him for not having mexico pay up front for it, and i support putting his feet to the fire there, but the fact is, till trump actually walked the walk, most politicians, including many of the ones blocking him, were all for a border barrier. and now all of a sudden, they're willing to shut down the government to prevent him from fulfilling the main thing he ran on, after he'd already cut at least 15 billion from the asking price.


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#17
Ryusei the Morning Star

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In 2013, when the Republicans defunded the ACA, Obama refused to sign the spending bill. Was Obama shutting the government down Roxas? If it's good for the goose it is good for the gander 


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#18
Phantom Roxas

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illegal immigration related problems (aka gangs, drugs, human trafficking, ect) have fallen noticeably


Cite your sources here.
 

they're willing to shut down the government to prevent him from fulfilling the main thing he ran on, after he'd already cut at least 15 billion from the asking price.


"I am proud to shut down the government for border security. I will take the mantle. I will be the one to shut it down.”

 

That is a direct quote from Trump himself. Trump openly admitted that he would be the one to shut down the government, and is only blaming the Democrats after the fact. Claiming that it's a "fact" that Democrats are the ones willing to shut down the government is just peddling the same false arguments as Trump, and ignores that they've already offered $1.3B for border security.

 

EDIT:

https://twitter.com/...653924063862784

 

While it is a joke, I would like to reiterate the question: Can you show what efforts McConnell has personally made to reopen the government?


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#19
Nathanael D. Striker

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Go.com: Trump postpones Pelosi's overseas trip after she proposed State of the
Union delay.
https://abcnews-go-c...ory?id=60444910

I am not surprised that Trump did this, though I do see the reasoning for this decision.

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#20
Phantom Roxas

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Go.com: Trump postpones Pelosi's overseas trip after she proposed State of the
Union delay.
https://abcnews-go-c...ory?id=60444910

I am not surprised that Trump did this, though I do see the reasoning for this decision.

 

He's being petty and vindictive because she suggested delaying the State of the Union address. What's also important is that this trip was supposed to be kept under wraps to preserve national security, so he blew the lid on this out of pure spite.

 

There is no good reasoning it. It was just a stupid move.


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